Are your dishes dirty? Phosphate Ban in Detergents

I know this isn't new news.

http://www.npr.org/2010/12/15/132...till-dirty

As my wife continued complaining about how dirty and disgusting our dishes continued to get. They truly were getting scummed up and getting worse over time. I decided to look back into this. Turns out the companies who make our dish washing detergent just decided the phosphate ban was coming and instead of having to deal with these states can use phosphates these can't. They just reformulated their recipe and are now selling the phosphate free detergent in all states now.

States have not banned use of phosphate detergent for businesses though. So you can still get it. I don't agree with banning for home use but not for businesses. But that's what's happening.

Found this place online after doing some research.
Bought some of the stuff we used to be able to buy.
http://www.restockit.com/cascade-...53pg).html
and presto sparkling clean dishes !!! Huge difference

Just in case this didn't work I found this article and bought some TSP from Amazon.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus...3141/posts

TSP from Amazon
http://www.amazon.com/Savogran-10...B0001GOGQW

Figured dumping all my gel detergent into a bucket and mixing might be my last resort. But we didn't have to, the Cascade works as it should and has for decades.

Posting just in case someone wants a single place to find all this info.

Quote from gnvdude : I know this isn't new news. http://www.npr.org/2010/12/15/132...till-dirty As my wife continued complaining about how dirty and disgusting our dishes continued to get. They truly were getting scummed up and getting worse over time. I decided to look back into this. Turns out the companies who make our dish washing detergent just decided the phosphate ban was coming and instead of having to deal with these states can use phosphates these can't. They just reformulated their recipe and are now selling the phosphate free detergent in all states now. States have not banned use of phosphate detergent for businesses though. So you can still get it. I don't agree with banning for home use but not for businesses. But that's what's happening. Found this place online after doing some research. Bought some of the stuff we used to be able to buy. http://www.restockit.com/cascade-...53pg).html and presto sparkling clean dishes !!! Huge difference Just in case this didn't work I found this article and bought some TSP from Amazon. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus...3141/posts TSP from Amazon http://www.amazon.com/Savogran-10...B0001GOGQW Figured dumping all my gel detergent into a bucket and mixing might be my last resort. But we didn't have to, the Cascade works as it should and has for decades. Posting just in case someone wants a single place to find all this info.

http://mises.org/daily/5267/Why-E...Is-Dirtier

Here is an excellent article on the subject from mises.org.

You should also know that TSP use to be an ingredient in laundry detergent as well, but it is similiarly disappearing.

If you want cleaner dishes and cleaner clothes you should add a bit of TSP, and make sure your water heater is set to a high enough setting (hotter water cleans better, who'd of thought!?!).

i noticed a coffee cup that didnt look clean, just rinsed it out though?

Quote from Count_Chocula : i noticed a coffee cup that didnt look clean, just rinsed it out though?

That's great.

I have a machine called a dishwasher that cleans my dishes for me. It's pretty cool.

Quote from Danman114 : If you want cleaner dishes and cleaner clothes you should add a bit of TSP, and make sure your water heater is set to a high enough setting (hotter water cleans better, who'd of thought!?!).

Washing in hot bleach (no water) will actually get you whiter whites than anything you've ever seen. Well, it might be hard to see the difference, what with your clothes dissolving in the chemical and all, but trust me--they'll be clean!

TSP remains widely available, even in California. I just bought 4.5 pounds at the Home Depot:

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/c...SEARCH+ALL

I use it to wash walls before painting. It's great stuff because it cuts through the grease and grime, and it etches (ie chemically burns) the paint, which makes the new paint layer stick better.

Now, some might say that a chemical so caustic that you have to wear rubber gloves and eye protection, and that burns anything it touches, is probably not something you want to put in your mouth. Those people are filthy, disgusting pigs. What's a little chemical burn compared to MRSA? What's a little throat cancer compared to norovirus? The benefit of clean clean clean dishes far exceeds the cost of using TSP, imo.

Quote from Danman114 : That's great. I have a machine called a dishwasher that cleans my dishes for me. It's pretty cool.

You have named your machines?

A victory for state's rights.

My dishes are clean and I am using Phosphate free detergent AND washing in cold water.

Am I doing something wrong???

That stuff you linked to is pretty expensive!

Quote : "I'm angry at the people who decided that phosphate was growing algae. I'm not sure that I believe that," Wright adds.

Quote from gnvdude : I know this isn't new news. http://www.npr.org/2010/12/15/132...till-dirty As my wife continued complaining about how dirty and disgusting our dishes continued to get. They truly were getting scummed up and getting worse over time. I decided to look back into this. Turns out the companies who make our dish washing detergent just decided the phosphate ban was coming and instead of having to deal with these states can use phosphates these can't. They just reformulated their recipe and are now selling the phosphate free detergent in all states now. States have not banned use of phosphate detergent for businesses though. So you can still get it. I don't agree with banning for home use but not for businesses. But that's what's happening. Found this place online after doing some research. Bought some of the stuff we used to be able to buy. http://www.restockit.com/cascade-...53pg).html and presto sparkling clean dishes !!! Huge difference Just in case this didn't work I found this article and bought some TSP from Amazon. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus...3141/posts TSP from Amazon http://www.amazon.com/Savogran-10...B0001GOGQW Figured dumping all my gel detergent into a bucket and mixing might be my last resort. But we didn't have to, the Cascade works as it should and has for decades. Posting just in case someone wants a single place to find all this info.

Phosphates usually end up enriching algal growth in lakes, rivers, streams, and even in the ocean in a process called eutrophication. I say the hell with it. It hurts tourism and the fishing industries. If you want your phosphate detergents perhaps your wife should devise a way to treat her nutrient rich gray water.

Quote from gunnerusa : Now, some might say that a chemical so caustic that you have to wear rubber gloves and eye protection, and that burns anything it touches, is probably not something you want to put in your mouth. Those people are filthy, disgusting pigs. What's a little chemical burn compared to MRSA? What's a little throat cancer compared to norovirus? The benefit of clean clean clean dishes far exceeds the cost of using TSP, imo.

And to your point, you certainly need to be careful not to add too much. This is though a chemical that was used routinelyin almost every dish and clothe cleaning product, and I think is still an important ingredient in Shout Sticks ( could be mistaken there) .

Quote from Danman114 : http://mises.org/daily/5267/Why-E...Is-Dirtier Here is an excellent article on the subject from mises.org. You should also know that TSP use to be an ingredient in laundry detergent as well, but it is similiarly disappearing. If you want cleaner dishes and cleaner clothes you should add a bit of TSP, and make sure your water heater is set to a high enough setting (hotter water cleans better, who'd of thought!?!).

Thanks for the link. It was a good read. I didn't know about the laundry detergents ban.

Politics aside (as Jeff Tucker brings in at the end) I wish this discussion got more press. I agree with the article that this seemed to happen while we were all sleeping.