Never use debit cards!

Yes, I meant why would anyone want a debit card to purchase things, I have a ATM only card.

Quote from financechick : he seems like a moron. why else would he use a debit card when penfed visa offers 5% back on gas & us bank cash+ gives 5% on food + a $25 bonus for a redemption of at least $100?

Perhaps because many gas stations will accept a debit card as being equivalent to a cash payment and will not charge an added fee like they do with credit cards (depending on the station, the increased cost of that fee can be considerably more than the 5% a credit card will give back).

Quote from RammsteinNicCag : Perhaps because many gas stations will accept a debit card as being equivalent to a cash payment and will not charge an added fee like they do with credit cards (depending on the station, the increased cost of that fee can be considerably more than the 5% a credit card will give back).

I've never seen a gas station charge more then maybe $0.05/gallon more for credit vs cash (and maybe debit). Since the cost of a gallon of gas is ~$3.50, that equates to a 1.4% cost to the customer. Assuming you get 2-5% cash back, it's still a profit. While there might be some stations that charge exorbinant transaction fees, I wouldn't shop there on principle.

In fact, if I see a place charging more for credit period, especially if they hide the fact, I generally avoid them since I don't like that business practice. It's called the cost of doing business.

Quote from phonic : I've never seen a gas station charge more then maybe $0.05/gallon more for credit vs cash (and maybe debit). Since the cost of a gallon of gas is ~$3.50, that equates to a 1.4% cost to the customer. Assuming you get 2-5% cash back, it's still a profit. While there might be some stations that charge exorbinant transaction fees, I wouldn't shop there on principle. In fact, if I see a place charging more for credit period, especially if they hide the fact, I generally avoid them since I don't like that business practice. It's called the cost of doing business.

I also try to avoid those stations. A month or so ago, we had a handful of stations (probably all the same owner) that had a VERY large discrepancy between cash and credit. Technically, they are not charging more for credit, but they're discounting cash. Their cash prices were actually cheaper than most other stations (by almost $0.50), but their credit prices were $2.00/gal higher than their cash prices (about a 40% mark-up). There was a huge uproar and the $2.00 went away, but it's still typical to see $0.10-$0.30 difference between cash and credit on Long Island.

Quote from RammsteinNicCag : I also try to avoid those stations. A month or so ago, we had a handful of stations (probably all the same owner) that had a VERY large discrepancy between cash and credit. Technically, they are not charging more for credit, but they're discounting cash. Their cash prices were actually cheaper than most other stations (by almost $0.50), but their credit prices were $2.00/gal higher than their cash prices (about a 40% mark-up). There was a huge uproar and the $2.00 went away, but it's still typical to see $0.10-$0.30 difference between cash and credit on Long Island.

The whole "cash discount" thing was to get around the Visa/MC restrictions on having a higher cost for credit card usage on transactions. Technically, selling something for $X, but then offering $X-$Y as a cash incentive wasn't against the rules.

However, many merchants didn't give a crap about the rules and simply do whatever they want. They know that even if someone reports them, nothing will come of it. Also, IIRC, they just changed the rules to allow for different pricing models depending on method of payment (a bunch of merchants sued visa/mc). So now it's fairly open to whatever they want.

In the end, it will come down to people and getting them to force the merchant's hand. We are becoming more and more a cashless society. And many merchants like to whine about the added fees, but forget about the savings. A credit card transaction can take seconds and be done with zero human involvement. Cash requires staffing employees, and that costs money. And the more people who use cash, the longer the lines are (or the more employees they need). And the longer the wait, the less likely people are to shop there, which in turn means less revenue and less profit.

Quote from phonic : And many merchants like to whine about the added fees, but forget about the savings. A credit card transaction can take seconds and be done with zero human involvement. Cash requires staffing employees, and that costs money. And the more people who use cash, the longer the lines are (or the more employees they need). And the longer the wait, the less likely people are to shop there, which in turn means less revenue and less profit.

Since we're talking about gas stations, I'll use gas stations as an example. The employee behind the counter is going to be there regardless. That employee (most, not all) can take cash and make change in the same amount of time (sometimes faster) it takes someone to run their credit card, sign for it if needed, have it approved, and get a receipt. So, oftentimes, there is no time savings.

Accepting credit cards costs business owners money. Why not offer a reward for someone who uses cash since they're saving the business owner money? It's a more transparent form of pricing rather than raising the prices of everything sold to every customer, just to cover the merchant processing fees.

Speaking as a business owner, I think you might be shocked at just how much of a cost just the merchant processing fees are for many businesses per month.

Quote from Brian1 : Since we're talking about gas stations, I'll use gas stations as an example. The employee behind the counter is going to be there regardless. That employee (most, not all) can take cash and make change in the same amount of time (sometimes faster) it takes someone to run their credit card, sign for it if needed, have it approved, and get a receipt. So, oftentimes, there is no time savings. Accepting credit cards costs business owners money. Why not offer a reward for someone who uses cash since they're saving the business owner money? It's a more transparent form of pricing rather than raising the prices of everything sold to every customer, just to cover the merchant processing fees. Speaking as a business owner, I think you might be shocked at just how much of a cost just the merchant processing fees are for many businesses per month.

A few points:
1) True, during normal business hours, gas stations will have employees staffed. But what about 3AM? Some keep the pumps open (for credit cards) even when the inside store is closed. No credit cards = no business.
2) For a slow store, sure, one employee might be sufficient. But there are many large gas stations (Race Trac/Race Way around here) where they have 20-30 pumps that are constantly being used during the day, with lines of cars waiting. Try getting all those people to pay cash and see how long the average wait is. People would drive off.
3) Most gas stations don't make you sign receipts, but that's assuming you go inside to make the purchase anyway. Which people very rarely do if paying by credit card. It takes me about 15 seconds to process my credit card at the pump, and 10 seconds of that is waiting for the machine to authorize it. It would take that long just for the clerk to enter in the pump number and swipe my card. Paying by cash? I would estimate more like a minute, especially if they need to count change out.
4) Speaking as someone who used to co-own a Point of Sale company, I know what the fees are. And I understand that they add up over time. However, again, it's the cost of doing business. Either eat the fee and deal with it, or raise your prices. If you want to offer a "cash discount", fine, I have zero problem with that. However, if you advertise $3.58/gallon on your big signs out front, and when I get to the pump I see it's really $3.68/gallon for credit cards, that is not acceptable. Advertise $3.68 and let people see the discount as a plus, not a reverse penalization.
5) If you are going to offer discounts, do it for everything, not just gas. If I buy a 2lt of soda, will I pay more for that with credit? No? Then why gas? Oh, the profit margin is smaller? Ok, then give me a reason to WANT to shop at your store inside, not blackmail. Maybe if the gas station didn't charge $8 for a 2-pack of tylenol, more people would buy it.
6) If you don't like the merchant processing fees, then there is a simple solution. Cancel your merchant account and accept only cash. Let's see what happens to your revenue in a month.
7) Again, most merchants forget about all the other issues with cash. Not only the time/labor it takes to accept it, but what about dealing with it afterwards? You need to pay/trust someone to count it. You need to store it securely. You need to transfer it to the bank securely. And speaking of security, the more cash you have, the bigger a target you are for robbers.

Quote from RammsteinNicCag : Perhaps because many gas stations will accept a debit card as being equivalent to a cash payment and will not charge an added fee like they do with credit cards (depending on the station, the increased cost of that fee can be considerably more than the 5% a credit card will give back).

Never heard of that...Do you go inside to pay?
I don't see how they can do that if you pay outside.

Quote from kyotuosa : Never heard of that...Do you go inside to pay? I don't see how they can do that if you pay outside.

Really? You never noticed when you swipe your card where the screen asks "Debit or Credit?". There's a reason why there's a keypad on the pump, and it's not just to enter you zip code (that feature came afterwards).

Quote from dzap : but I have a Freedom and it does not have blink.

mine does - ask them to add it or take it off if you want (I asked chase to take it off of my debit card and they did it with no problems)

also, at the pump, if you pay by cash, you need to go in, pay, fill up, and then go get your change or drive off with a not-quite-full tank, so you need to go inside TWICE - which is good for business, because while your there waiting in line you might be tempted to buy a magazine or a candy bar/etc. but bad for the customer (wasting their time)

Quote from phonic : Really? You never noticed when you swipe your card where the screen asks "Debit or Credit?". There's a reason why there's a keypad on the pump, and it's not just to enter you zip code (that feature came afterwards).

I am saying extra 5+% for using credit......I never seen it using it on the pump machine.

Quote from kyotuosa : I am saying extra 5+% for using credit......I never seen it using it on the pump machine.

If a gas stations charges extra for credit card use (which is normally ~$0.05/gallon more, not a straight percentage), you would usually see this on the pump itself on the pricing screens over each type of fuel. They will show you the cash price and the credit price.

Whether they offer the cash price for debit, that isn't as common based on my experience. But if so, they would probably say so on a sticker on the pump itself. Or you could ask.

They really should treat debit as cash, otherwise they are making a bigger profit off of you that way.

While credit transactions incur a transaction fee ($0.10ish, but it varies significantly on a number of factors), they also charge a percentage fee for the total amount (ie: 1-3%, which again fluctuates wildly).

Debit transactions however ONLY incur a transaction fee ($0.10-$0.20ish). No percentage on the amount. This is why you can get cash back from some stores, because the total amount is irrelevant. Which means if they charge $0.05/gallon more for debit too, and you fill up 20 gallons, they made an extra $0.90ish in profit off of you.

Quote from phonic : A few points: 1) True, during normal business hours, gas stations will have employees staffed. But what about 3AM? Some keep the pumps open (for credit cards) even when the inside store is closed. No credit cards = no business. 2) For a slow store, sure, one employee might be sufficient. But there are many large gas stations (Race Trac/Race Way around here) where they have 20-30 pumps that are constantly being used during the day, with lines of cars waiting. Try getting all those people to pay cash and see how long the average wait is. People would drive off. 3) Most gas stations don't make you sign receipts, but that's assuming you go inside to make the purchase anyway. Which people very rarely do if paying by credit card. It takes me about 15 seconds to process my credit card at the pump, and 10 seconds of that is waiting for the machine to authorize it. It would take that long just for the clerk to enter in the pump number and swipe my card. Paying by cash? I would estimate more like a minute, especially if they need to count change out. 4) Speaking as someone who used to co-own a Point of Sale company, I know what the fees are. And I understand that they add up over time. However, again, it's the cost of doing business. Either eat the fee and deal with it, or raise your prices. If you want to offer a "cash discount", fine, I have zero problem with that. However, if you advertise $3.58/gallon on your big signs out front, and when I get to the pump I see it's really $3.68/gallon for credit cards, that is not acceptable. Advertise $3.68 and let people see the discount as a plus, not a reverse penalization. 5) If you are going to offer discounts, do it for everything, not just gas. If I buy a 2lt of soda, will I pay more for that with credit? No? Then why gas? Oh, the profit margin is smaller? Ok, then give me a reason to WANT to shop at your store inside, not blackmail. Maybe if the gas station didn't charge $8 for a 2-pack of tylenol, more people would buy it. 6) If you don't like the merchant processing fees, then there is a simple solution. Cancel your merchant account and accept only cash. Let's see what happens to your revenue in a month. 7) Again, most merchants forget about all the other issues with cash. Not only the time/labor it takes to accept it, but what about dealing with it afterwards? You need to pay/trust someone to count it. You need to store it securely. You need to transfer it to the bank securely. And speaking of security, the more cash you have, the bigger a target you are for robbers.

That's the beauty of the free market. If you don't like it (whatever "it" is), you don't have to shop there. If there are enough people like you who walk, the business responds or loses out.

More to the original post's topic, who's keeping $85k in their checking account? Long string of poor financial decisions.