Banning of Buckyballs by the CPSC

Quote from 124nic8 : Not a strawman. Making the comparison to other products strongly implies that they are considered anologous. They aren't.

Almost every time you ask one of these "questions", its a strawman.
In this case it's a strawman because the person didn't suggest they were analagous as far as "necesarry utility" is concerned.
They're analagous in a much more important way.
They're all things that have led to the deaths of children.

It would be different if you actually introduced it as your own argument instead of presenting it as a question as if that was their position.
You could come in and make the argument that you wouldn't agree with banning those items because they have a "necessary utility".
Which is really the argument you are making.
Yet you're asking it as a question, I assume because you think you're being witty.
You need to stop being so ridiculous with those strawman questions and just make the argument you're trying to make.
It will lead to much better debates for you and whoever you're debating, not to mention far more interesting for those reading it.

Quote from Xygonn : 42 from skateboards in 2011. http://www.skatepark.org/park-dev...esActivity Around 100 from balloons from 1972-1992 (5 per year). In fact, a cursory google search shows that balloons are the most frequent nonfood cause of choking death in children. http://www.nytimes.com/1997/03/13...azard.html http://childsafetycentral.com/toy...zards.html http://www.safekidsgainesvillehal...toy-safety

Just a note these numbers need to be normalize against product volume to be meaningful.

Quote from agent00f : Just a note these numbers need to be normalize against product volume to be meaningful.

Ok, well normalize then take a ratio:

Buckyballs=0 Deaths per X sold

Skateboards=42 deaths per Y sold


(0/X)/(42/Y)=0

Buckyballs are 100% safer than skateboards in terms of fatalities. Whew, I didn't even need real sales units because buckyballs have only cause "near" deaths.

Likewise they are 100% safer than balloons for the same reason.

To be fair we should probably be using (2N+1)/(2T) types of numbers because of the zero fatalities. So, I admit to lack of rigor.

Quote from hsjpatman : Almost every time you ask one of these "questions", its a strawman. In this case it's a strawman because the person didn't suggest they were analagous as far as "necesarry utility" is concerned. They're analagous in a much more important way. They're all things that have led to the deaths of children. It would be different if you actually introduced it as your own argument instead of presenting it as a question as if that was their position. You could come in and make the argument that you wouldn't agree with banning those items because they have a "necessary utility". Which is really the argument you are making. Yet you're asking it as a question, I assume because you think you're being witty. You need to stop being so ridiculous with those strawman questions and just make the argument you're trying to make. It will lead to much better debates for you and whoever you're debating, not to mention far more interesting for those reading it.

almost every time you post you go around incorrectly pointing out things that you believe to be strawmen in other people's posts. get a new trick.

also, this thread just shows how far the conservative right will go to satiate their bloodlust. it's not just enough that they want to have the right to kill people and thus own guns, but they want the right to kill people incidentally with products that are clearly unsafe.

Quote from Hawk2007 : Imagine if you had built the Zen Magnet or Buckyball company and suddenly the government was saying that you could no longer sell your product.... at all.

imagine if you had built the zen magnet or buckyball company and your products were responsible for the deaths of children.

Quote from thikthird : almost every time you post you go around incorrectly pointing out things that you believe to be strawmen in other people's posts. get a new trick. also, this thread just shows how far the conservative right will go to satiate their bloodlust. it's not just enough that they want to have the right to kill people and thus own guns, but they want the right to kill people incidentally with products that are clearly unsafe. imagine if you had built the zen magnet or buckyball company and your products were responsible for the deaths of children.

whats unsafe about the product when used the correct way?
Please explain how any of these magnetic balls can harm someone when used properly as per the advertising?

why did death of children occur? oh because of negligence of adults.
would it have occurred with proper supervision?

Quote from thikthird : also, this thread just shows how far the conservative right will go to satiate their bloodlust. it's not just enough that they want to have the right to kill people and thus own guns, but they want the right to kill people incidentally with products that are clearly unsafe. imagine if you had built the zen magnet or buckyball company and your products were responsible for the deaths of children.

Wow... At first I read this and took it as sarcasm on the first section because that was just ignorant. Really, "satiate their bloodlust. it's not just enough that they want to have the right to kill people" You come into a discussion about buckyballs and appear to just be trolling. You think the magnets are the problem? If that is the case should we take away all products that are not needed to survive that have a possibility of a choking hazard? That is just ignorant. I mean before today I had no idea what buckyballs even were, but this isn't te company's fault. The blame lies with the parents of these kids. Hell, maybe it happened to one of your kids and thats why you try to blame others... Typical Liberals

Quote from IPT : whats unsafe about the product when used the correct way? Please explain how any of these magnetic balls can harm someone when used properly as per the advertising? why did death of children occur? oh because of negligence of adults. would it have occurred with proper supervision?

this just in: in the real world products aren't always used as intended.

Quote from happyhunting : Wow... At first I read this and took it as sarcasm on the first section because that was just ignorant. Really, "satiate their bloodlust. it's not just enough that they want to have the right to kill people" You come into a discussion about buckyballs and appear to just be trolling. You think the magnets are the problem? If that is the case should we take away all products that are not needed to survive that have a possibility of a choking hazard? That is just ignorant. I mean before today I had no idea what buckyballs even were, but this isn't te company's fault. The blame lies with the parents of these kids. Hell, maybe it happened to one of your kids and thats why you try to blame others... Typical Liberals

ah yes, blame the dead. if all the people who misuse them die off then there will no longer be a problem.

So we should ban it because some adults are too stupid to keep the item away from children, correct?

Quote from thikthird : this just in: in the real world products aren't always used as intended. ah yes, blame the dead. if all the people who misuse them die off then there will no longer be a problem.

Who died from buckyballs? I found lots of stories about near deaths, but I can't find one on a fatality.

A dozen swallowed the magnets in 2009, some needed surgery.

Quote from thikthird : imagine if you had built the zen magnet or buckyball company and irresponsible parents were responsible for the deaths of children.

Fixed that for ya.

Quote from thikthird : also, this thread just shows how far the conservative right will go to satiate their bloodlust. it's not just enough that they want to have the right to kill people and thus own guns, but they want the right to kill people incidentally with products that are clearly unsafe.

Yeah, these guys, the owners of Buckyballs and Zen Magnets, look like your stereotypical evil right wing conservatives. lol

Quote : imagine if you had built the zen magnet or buckyball company and your products were responsible for the deaths of children.

Except they haven't been.

This is a ridiculous case. There are literally millions of products and other things in this world that are NOT designed for children which are dangerous in various ways. Many much more so. It would be different if it was some component of a kid's product or sold as a kid's toy. The products are labeled with appropriate warnings as required which is appropriate in this case since the danger may not be obvious. It's also appropriate that the CPSC issues a warning to increase awareness that there's a potential safety issue. Beyond that what are you going to do, take every product that poses a POTENTIAL risk to kids off of the market? Don't forget push pins, button batteries, paper clips, marshmallows, pills, gasoline, bean seeds, etc., etc., all of which have caused actual deaths.

Quote from thikthird : this just in: in the real world products aren't always used as intended. ah yes, blame the dead. if all the people who misuse them die off then there will no longer be a problem.

so buckyballs are suppose to be eaten then in real life applications?

Quote from Xygonn : Who died from buckyballs? I found lots of stories about near deaths, but I can't find one on a fatality. A dozen swallowed the magnets in 2009, some needed surgery.

I was going to ask this same question. The most recent article I found was a "near death" after a 3 year old managed to swallow 37 buckyballs. Thirty-seven! I wonder how long that took.


I have a friend who lets their child play with Buckyballs under direct supervision, and they can be fun and creative toys. When they're not out for play with Mom and/or Dad, they're put away in a safe place. Sure, they're not supposed to be toys for children (because parents cannot be trusted to be intelligent about their use), but they do make great tools for creativity.

Quote from trancepire : I was going to ask this same question. The most recent article I found was a "near death" after a 3 year old managed to swallow 37 buckyballs. Thirty-seven! I wonder how long that took.

[parents found him stuck to the refrigerator]