NFL Referee Lockout

Quote from paperboy05 : Depends on when you consider the catch starts: At this point Tate didn't really have any part of the ball. As well as here:

Quote from Danman114 : I thought the same until I read the part of the rule that says: It is not a simultaneous catch if a player gains control first and an opponent subsequently gains joint control. I originally thought it depended on 'possession', which in football is pretty involved (between having two feet in ground, a football move, and whatever else), but if it's simply first to have 'control', I have to give that to the DB who put two mitts on the ball, and never really bobbled it.

You also need the angle from the local news camera:

http://www.q13fox.com/sports/foot...1209.story

In slow motion he puts both hands on the ball just before Golden Tate places his left hand on the ball (even in your picture his left hand is obstructed). In real time it isn't as obvious.

Below you can see Golden Tate's left hand about to touch the ball very nearly the same time as Jennings gets either hand on the ball.



Another with all the hands on:



One handed catches happen all the time. So control of the ball isn't that obvious in this situation.

The more I look into it, the more it looks like Tate gets his hand on maybe even first.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoSB9PHR6yA

Quote from Tony_Danza : Pretty small sampling size to determine impact. You don't think that if the replacement refs had continued and performed the way they were it would have no impact on nfl revenue?

I can't see why. Every sportscaster there was basically saying this was going to go on a long time.. b/c it wasn't effecting the number of people viewing. It made people angry sure.. but they continued to watch.

Given more time, they would've had adequately trained refs being used. Also as each week goes on, they obviously get a little better.

I actually believe the concern came from a couple hits taken and strategy by coaches. It was spoken about how coaches would try certain tactics knowing what ref was doing what. Meaning they have tendencies to let certain penalties go. These refs missed some very harsh personal fowls that even had one player sent to the hospital w/ no call. When players think they can get away with it.. they will do hit to injure. Now you're toying w/ possible lawsuits, for possibly permanently injured players.

People are going to watch NFL football regardless of how long refs are gone.. they used replacement players before for weeks.. they're not concerned about refs nearly as much. Vegas i'm sure gets uneasy because they can no longer anticipate properly what should occur.. games start going up for grabs regardless of statistical analysis (like GB vs. Seattle).

Quote from Xygonn : You also need the angle from the local news camera: http://www.q13fox.com/sports/foot...1209.story In slow motion he puts both hands on the ball just before Golden Tate places his left hand on the ball (even in your picture his left hand is obstructed). In real time it isn't as obvious. Below you can see Golden Tate's left hand about to touch the ball very nearly the same time as Jennings gets either hand on the ball.

I guess what it comes down to is the NFL's definition of possession, which I have no idea after all of their reception rule changes.

Good picture though, now we just need teams to wear different color gloves

Quote from paperboy05 : I guess what it comes down to is the NFL's definition of possession, which I have no idea after all of their reception rule changes. Good picture though, now we just need teams to wear different color gloves

Note: Even though I live in Washington, I'm not much of a Hawks fan. I started GB's defense in Fantasy Football. Also, added some more info in my last post.

Quote from Xygonn : Note: Even though I live in Washington, I'm not much of a Hawks fan. I started GB's defense in Fantasy Football. Also, added some more info in my last post.

Ouch, I hope you still won.

Quote from paperboy05 : Ouch, I hope you still won.

Yeah, I did. Mostly because the other team self-destructed and Jason Hanson had a buttload of points for me (18.5 in my league). Also I picked up Alfred Morris off the FA list after week one (because I can see the future).

Quote from Xygonn : Yeah, I did. Mostly because the other team self-destructed and Jason Hanson had a buttload of points for me (18.5 in my league). Also I picked up Alfred Morris off the FA list after week one (because I can see the future).

Ha, nice. I almost lost because of Hanson, that was crazy. See about Ryan Williams in AZ ?

Also, I guess this is more of a lounge thread now, whoops

Quote from paperboy05 : Ha, nice. I almost lost because of Hanson, that was crazy. See about Ryan Williams in AZ ? Also, I guess this is more of a lounge thread now, whoops

One more lounge-like post. This week, Daniel Thomas will be the starter at Miami. He is probably better than whatever you currently have at your flex position. Even't a terrible RB should come up with 6 points. WRs are unreliable.

What about Ryan Williams aside from needing to step in as starter (he is owned in my league)?

Quote from Xygonn : One more lounge-like post. This week, Daniel Thomas will be the starter at Miami. He is probably better than whatever you currently have at your flex position. Even't a terrible RB should come up with 6 points. WRs are unreliable. What about Ryan Williams aside from needing to step in as starter (he is owned in my league)?

I'm in a PPR league with Lloyd as my flex right now, and Thomas was swiped before my waiver position, and my other league we don't have a flex and are limited with transactions

And since AZ shelved Beanie, Ryan is the head back right now. Supposedly has good upside after this week. Fingers crossed as I was able to snag him in a league.

Quote from ikonoklast : Why shouldn't the refs get a piece of the lucrative NFL pie? It's like when people complain about athletes making too much money, why shouldn't they be compensated if they are the reason people tune in to watch and in return earn the teams and the leagues lots of money. Refs are a big part of the game and they should be compensated. This not your 9-5 job, this is different.

You're right. It's your 1-6 job - 1 day a week.

I don't know about you but I don't watch any professional sport for the refs. The ONLY one I could even remotely possibly see people saying they do is bull riding and it's more for their costumes and well they aren't exactly refs. Cheerleaders on the other hand are a different story and they're paid less than minimum wage basically. How come they aren't out there making $75k a year???

If the NFL had a pair they would have told them to piss off and get long term contracts in place for good college refs. The thing though is that they didn't. They couldn't guarantee anything, or actually they weren't willing to, so most college refs, the ones that would have actually done a better job than these guys stuck with their full time gig. The NFL really F'ed up here. In the end I'm sure it's peanuts to their bottom line so who really cares...

Nice to see some lounge flavor on this podium thread

Quote from DJPlayer : Does anyone know how much Vegas made on the MNF play, considering approx 80%+ was betting on GB? The house made an absolute killing on that decision.

I listen to a sports betting podcast and I think one of the big guys estimated Vegas had about $15M one way or the other on that game. He said that the house actually made more money in the Vikings upset over the Niners because it wrecked so many parlay tickets for the week.

Quote from ASG : I listen to a sports betting podcast and I think one of the big guys estimated Vegas had about $15M one way or the other on that game. He said that the house actually made more money in the Vikings upset over the Niners because it wrecked so many parlay tickets for the week.

ehh.. not sure If I'd buy into that one.. but I'm sure the public was heavier on the Niners than that Vikings. But you have to consider the amount of betting that goes on Monday night. Every single lush out out there that lost over the weekend.. has one game Monday to make up their loss and break even. On top of that you have all those ridiculous number of props bets. Even when I first say the game line at G.B. -3, I thought it was a gift. But NFL is unpredictable.. and even more unpredictable with the replacement Refs.

The house one big on Monday night.. but imagine the impact when people start saying the refs are bought off.. I mean they are just standing in as temps right? Having just a single ref in your corner (just even slightly impartial) would be worth what to the gambling industry? A million? I'm glad the refs are back regardless.. those replacements were just embarrassing. They weren't even NCAA caliber (which they were coming from lesser leagues).

Quote from LivninSC : You're right. It's your 1-6 job - 1 day a week. I don't know about you but I don't watch any professional sport for the refs. The ONLY one I could even remotely possibly see people saying they do is bull riding and it's more for their costumes and well they aren't exactly refs. Cheerleaders on the other hand are a different story and they're paid less than minimum wage basically. How come they aren't out there making $75k a year??? If the NFL had a pair they would have told them to piss off and get long term contracts in place for good college refs. The thing though is that they didn't. They couldn't guarantee anything, or actually they weren't willing to, so most college refs, the ones that would have actually done a better job than these guys stuck with their full time gig. The NFL really F'ed up here. In the end I'm sure it's peanuts to their bottom line so who really cares...

That's what you got from my post? That people don't watch the NFL for the refs?

Well duh. I meant that when people complain about athletes making too much, they are off base since they are the reason people tune in to watch, not the refs. I was just making a comparison. Much like how these athletes have a particular set of skills, these refs have a particular set of skills. That is quite obvious when you look at the performance of the replacement refs. And this particular set of skills allows them to ask for obscene amounts of money. If good accountants were as rare as these refs, they'd make obscene amount of money as well. Just because YOU think someone doesn't deserve the money doesn't mean they don't deserve it, if that makes any sense.

Wouldn't you want more money from a league that makes a ton directly from your labor? Yeah, I am sure you would be like "I am good" because you don't deserve the obscene amount of money.

Quote from rrc06 : Nice to see some lounge flavor on this podium thread

Lounge logic > podium logic.