Men's Marmot PreCip Rain Jacket (Peacoat or Fatigue) $48 + Free Store Pickup

Quote from lpranal : stoic vaporshell (stash has been at this price several times too, on steep and cheap): http://www.backcountry.com/stoic-...3_c3d80b31 the vaporshell is an excellent product. Kind of a shame backcountry is doing away with the stoic brand, they had some really awesome stuff way cheaper than the "name" brands.

Did they say why they getting rid of Stoic?

Quote from bluetrep : it is strange this kind of overpriced store still in business

REI? I'm sure the cash cow for them is the 20% coupons that draw people in. And then the lax lifetime return policy that keeps people coming back.

Quote from jplee3 : Interesting... some ugly colors though, and what's up with that horizontal zipper?

I linked to the anorak because it's cheaper, the regular vaporshell jacket has some more "palatable" colors but isn't as deeply discounted (yet... like i said stoic is going bye-bye so it's conceivable you might be able to pick it up for cheaper. Right now the XXLs in the regular jacket are ~50 and if you keep an eye on steep and cheap, you can probably find "normal sizes for that") If you're not picky about appearance, you'll usually get a better deal

Incidentally, the vaporshell anorak is actually designed with that horizontal zipper / pocket placement so it allows for access even when wearing a climbing harness / backpack. I actually got a similar patagonia goretex jacket at a garage sale for $5 one time, it has two chest mounted 8x8 pockets that look ridiculous, but the only ones I usually run across in the backcountry have 4 legs and fur

Quote from jplee3 : Yea, this doesn't seem like much of a "technical" jacket lol. Guess we'll see how we like them when they arrive...

Just don't wash them with regular detergent (kills the DWR) and dry them on medium heat and you'll be fine.

Quote from Snowclimb : Did they say why they getting rid of Stoic?

I heard that their designers were blinded by the hideous colors they were using...

In truth, I'm guessing there are just too many people out there that buy based off brand names rather than people that actually test and rely on the stuff. Marketing $$$ trumps quality materials and R&D far too often I'm afraid.

Quote from lpranal : I heard that their designers were blinded by the hideous colors they were using... In truth, I'm guessing there are just too many people out there that buy based off brand names rather than people that actually test and rely on the stuff. Marketing $$$ trumps quality materials and R&D far too often I'm afraid.

eh- all of the stoic stuff i have (6 or so pieces?) are ALMOST great pieces of gear. there just seemed to be a little something wrong with each one of them.

I stopped buying stoic after I picked up a stoic down vest- the zipper gets stuck (and is starting to shred the zipper guard) every single time i zip it up. it's infuriating over time.

hmm, just remembered they have lifetime warranty- i may actually return this and get something better made...

Quote from lpranal : stoic vaporshell (stash has been at this price several times too, on steep and cheap): http://www.backcountry.com/stoic-...3_c3d80b31 the vaporshell is an excellent product. Kind of a shame backcountry is doing away with the stoic brand, they had some really awesome stuff way cheaper than the "name" brands.

ah- didn't realize the vaporshell was a rebranded (kinda like DryQ) eVent. I might have given it a try, but I ended up grabbing an REI Kimtah rain jacket when they had their 50% off REI branded clothing sale. I don't regret it one bit- it's an amazing jacket.

thanx OP - great deal

Quote from lpranal : No, this is probably the cheapest this particular jacket has been, although I have seen better jackets for about the same / even less. Keep in mind this is coming from the perspective of someone who is pretty demanding of my outerwear... I snowboard, snowshoe, mountain bike, backpack / hike pretty much year round. I guess your "average" person who needs a rain jacket for the 2 minute trek from the parking lot to their office probably wouldn't need or appreciate the benefits of more "technical" gear, and by no means is it a BAD product.

So (reading comprehension challenged) you would definitely favor the stoic you linked to over the Marmot?


If so, could you go into detail as to why -- better breathing or what?


TIA!

Quote from Perknose : So (reading comprehension challenged) you would definitely favor the stoic you linked to over the Marmot? If so, could you go into detail as to why -- better breathing or what? TIA!

Sure, it mostly has to do with the type of waterproofing. the Precip is DWR based (though marmot uses a really, really good version from reviews I've seen). Basically the waterproofing is all in a coating on the exterior of the material - water beads off and doesn't have a chance to soak through. The only problem with this is that water can and does eventually saturate the fabric, defeating the waterproofing. It's also prone to wearing off over time, although again, Marmot uses a ceramic additive to make the DWR more durable. Dirt, oils, residue and even smoke can impede the waterproofing of the material and allow water to wick through.

Membrane based waterproofing, like that in eVent or goretex, steps the waterproofing by adding a layer of microporous material that is small enough to let water vapor (sweat) out but not water in. So even if the outer surface gets saturated ("wets out") water won't penetrate inside. DWR is still applied to the outside, since if the outer layer gets saturated even goretex or event won't breathe. This is usually only important during all day soaking rains or when, for example, you're sitting / laying on something wet or snow gets "caked" on. Even the best coatings can let water pass through. I've had my DryQ jacket wet out once before in a heavy freezing rain / sleet/ snow while snowshoing... it's not pleasant but it kept me warm and dry (if a bit clammy) but it would have been way worse without the extra membrane from the eVent!

Quote from lpranal : Sure, it mostly has to do with the type of waterproofing. the Precip is DWR based (though marmot uses a really, really good version from reviews I've seen). Basically the waterproofing is all in a coating on the exterior of the material - water beads off and doesn't have a chance to soak through. The only problem with this is that water can and does eventually saturate the fabric, defeating the waterproofing. It's also prone to wearing off over time, although again, Marmot uses a ceramic additive to make the DWR more durable. Dirt, oils, residue and even smoke can impede the waterproofing of the material and allow water to wick through.

I'm relatively sure this is incorrect. Even the low-end precip uses a membrane, that while not nearly as breathable as goretex, and especially eVent, will still stay waterproof if the DWR fails.

What happens when the DWR fails though (and this can happen to goretex or eVent as well) is that it loses its breathability, as the water sticking to the jacket prevents any vapor from passing through the waterproof breathable membrane. When a jacket wets out like this, the water you feel inside the jacket is likely your own sweat that is no longer able to evaporate. If you can actually see/feel water entering the jacket from the outside, it means that the jacket is defective or worn so much that the membrane has ripped, most likely at the seams

But it takes a while for the DWR to fail, and it can be re-applied when it does, so I highly recommend a more breathable jacket if you can afford it.

ah, yes, here it is:

http://marmot.com/products/precip_jacket

"The key to PreCip® is its barrier technology: a microporous polyurethane that is impregnated with silicon dioxide particles. These particles create small, numerous, very consistent holes that allow the barrier to pass small water vapor molecules but not the bigger liquid ones. "

Yeah, I bought the precip because it was just a shell. I already have a marmot mantra from a previous deal and it has kept me very warm.

As for the DWR wearing off, I've heard that products like Grangers wash-in treatment brings the coating back like new, though I haven't had the chance to buy that yet. The mantra is my first ever waterproof jacket and I only purchased that about 1 month ago.

Quote from lpranal : stoic vaporshell (stash has been at this price several times too, on steep and cheap): http://www.backcountry.com/stoic-...3_c3d80b31 the vaporshell is an excellent product. Kind of a shame backcountry is doing away with the stoic brand, they had some really awesome stuff way cheaper than the "name" brands.

Man, if only that jacket came in small, I would've been all over that jacket.
Thanks for bringing this brand/line to my attention. I've heard of eVent jackets but everything I've seen were just prohibitively expensive for my budget, especially since I live in a place where I don't really get wet all that often.

Quote from juvenescence : Man, if only that jacket came in small, I would've been all over that jacket. Thanks for bringing this brand/line to my attention. I've heard of eVent jackets but everything I've seen were just prohibitively expensive for my budget, especially since I live in a place where I don't really get wet all that often.

remember, you usually want to size up so that you can layer under it. i'm normally a small but my rain jackets are mediums

Quote from pso : remember, you usually want to size up so that you can layer under it. i'm normally a small but my rain jackets are mediums

Yeah but the jackets themselves also tend to be a bit larger than normal because they assume you would layer underneath.
That said, small is just about right on the jackets I've tried on. I'm basically swimming in a size medium. And I'm 5'7" with an athletic build.