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B.S. in MIS ... Considering Switching Careers and Need Advice On What To Do ?

Xplic1T 684 224 December 2, 2015 at 10:18 PM
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Hello SD Readers,

I'm in my late 20's and have come to the realization that what was once my passion in life now feels meaningless and empty.

When I was younger, I loved working with computers with a passion. I was really good at it and would dabble in almost everything from programming to 3d/cad design. Since I had a broad range of interests and experiences, and since I had fairly good communication skills and drive, I decided to go the MIS route with an emphasis in Business. I got hired right out of college at a startup that a friend helped me land a job in. The only downside is that I was brought in as Sales Development. I never really had done sales but I did my best and was doing ok for my first real gig. After about 8 months, the company had a massive lay off and 1/3 of the company was dissolved ... my friend and I were in that group of 15 that got let go.

I got another job a few months after working for a MSP where I was basically a sys admin for about 2 dozen different law firms. I was getting paid practically minimum wage and had to use my own car driving from site to site to do minor things like setting up new computes all the way to more major things like setting up NAS systems for redundant backup. I loved the work but the hours were insane and I started to lose my passion because I had virtually no way to progress. After much thought, I ended up leaving and went to work as a Customer Support Tech for a software company in the aviation field. I liked helping people but after seeing what was going on behind the scenes and how poorly the code implementations and fixes were done ... I ended up leaving to find something else. It just wasn't fulfilling and I kept feeling like I was lying to customers in order to make up for the shortcomings of poor management and development ... During that time, I won an employee of the year award and was trying to sidetrack my way into the IT dept. at this company (which only consisted of 1 person) but a few months later it was a no go after pretty much being promised the position.

I decided I needed to take some time to find myself and try to re-ignite my passion. A few months after that I started working at the company I am with now as a Support Engineer providing back-line support for many enterprise SAN/NAS systems out on the market along with different tape libraries. I am learning a lot but again I feel like I'm in a production line working day in and day out without any light at the end of the tunnel for growth. The pay is ok, but there is virtually no moving up in this company since it only consists of 9 people... A majority of the company is family and since I'm not family ... I don't get to take 3 hour lunches and slack off for most of the day. I also am on call every 3rd week and sometimes have to take calls at 2, 3, 4 in the morning and am expected to arrive the next day at 7 am. It just isn't what I thought I was going to be doing ... For some reason, I can't seem to land any interviews at bigger companies and only seem destined to work for smaller institutions.

I'm 28 and I'm frustrated ... no girlfriend/wife/kids and I thought I did everything right. Most of my friends slacked off in school and now are CPAs and Managers at other companies while I worked hard and feel like I'm in quicksand trying to make it through the day. I guess it's safe to say that I lost my passion in this field. It seems like if you don't want to program, you are dead to the industry because all of your jobs are being shipped overseas.

I've been battling depression for years now and feel like my best years are behind me. Help me figure out what I can/should do to still my degree / experience count towards something more meaningful and fulfilling career wise... Please

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#2
Quote from Xplic1T View Post :
Hello SD Readers,

I'm in my late 20's and have come to the realization that what was once my passion in life now feels meaningless and empty.

When I was younger, I loved working with computers with a passion. I was really good at it and would dabble in almost everything from programming to 3d/cad design. Since I had a broad range of interests and experiences, and since I had fairly good communication skills and drive, I decided to go the MIS route with an emphasis in Business. I got hired right out of college at a startup that a friend helped me land a job in. The only downside is that I was brought in as Sales Development. I never really had done sales but I did my best and was doing ok for my first real gig. After about 8 months, the company had a massive lay off and 1/3 of the company was dissolved ... my friend and I were in that group of 15 that got let go.

I got another job a few months after working for a MSP where I was basically a sys admin for about 2 dozen different law firms. I was getting paid practically minimum wage and had to use my own car driving from site to site to do minor things like setting up new computes all the way to more major things like setting up NAS systems for redundant backup. I loved the work but the hours were insane and I started to lose my passion because I had virtually no way to progress. After much thought, I ended up leaving and went to work as a Customer Support Tech for a software company in the aviation field. I liked helping people but after seeing what was going on behind the scenes and how poorly the code implementations and fixes were done ... I ended up leaving to find something else. It just wasn't fulfilling and I kept feeling like I was lying to customers in order to make up for the shortcomings of poor management and development ... During that time, I won an employee of the year award and was trying to sidetrack my way into the IT dept. at this company (which only consisted of 1 person) but a few months later it was a no go after pretty much being promised the position.

I decided I needed to take some time to find myself and try to re-ignite my passion. A few months after that I started working at the company I am with now as a Support Engineer providing back-line support for many enterprise SAN/NAS systems out on the market along with different tape libraries. I am learning a lot but again I feel like I'm in a production line working day in and day out without any light at the end of the tunnel for growth. The pay is ok, but there is virtually no moving up in this company since it only consists of 9 people... A majority of the company is family and since I'm not family ... I don't get to take 3 hour lunches and slack off for most of the day. I also am on call every 3rd week and sometimes have to take calls at 2, 3, 4 in the morning and am expected to arrive the next day at 7 am. It just isn't what I thought I was going to be doing ... For some reason, I can't seem to land any interviews at bigger companies and only seem destined to work for smaller institutions.

I'm 28 and I'm frustrated ... no girlfriend/wife/kids and I thought I did everything right. Most of my friends slacked off in school and now are CPAs and Managers at other companies while I worked hard and feel like I'm in quicksand trying to make it through the day. I guess it's safe to say that I lost my passion in this field. It seems like if you don't want to program, you are dead to the industry because all of your jobs are being shipped overseas.

I've been battling depression for years now and feel like my best years are behind me. Help me figure out what I can/should do to still my degree / experience count towards something more meaningful and fulfilling career wise... Please

I sympathize and completely understand your frustration. I have said it before many times on this site to those looking to go into IT (or anything technical) these days...BAD choice. The simple fact of the matter is we do not build much of anything anymore in this country and many of the high tech jobs are being outsourced and you are competing with third world slave labor. Add in that as you get older and do make more money (and cost more), companies look to replace you with younger workers or workers overseas. That is unlikely to change and indeed it is likely to get worse.

IT in particular is one of the worst in this respect where they work you long hours, you go unappreciated in most cases and then you are discarded. The schools are generally just spouting propaganda for the industry to try to keep up the supply of cheap IT labor so as to help further the push out of the older workers. Ask yourself how many 60+ year old developers do you see these days...not a whole lot. That is not to say you can not succeed in IT, but the number of people that rise to some BS VP job are few and far between.

I worked in IT for many years rising to Director of Dev\Ops for a major application suite of a medium sized company. Got laid off with the rest of the place once they decided to outsource most everybody (IT, Customer Service, Accounts Payable, etc.) so I know of what I speak. They laid off almost everyone in IT over 40 some odd years old who was not some management crony as well. Fortunately I also had a business in real estate that I got into thanks to my parents and decided to just go full bore into that and screw IT.

As to what to do, I would look to get into business yourself doing something you find interesting\think you are good at. I know it is hard to throw away what you have spent the better part of your life pursuing, but trust me, it is the right thing to do in the long run. Not saying it will not be difficult and the path will not be littered with problems, but in the end you succeed or fail on your own merits, answerable to yourself and whoever else you go into business with and you will find it much more rewarding personally than taking orders from morons and a-holes just looking to see how much they can abuse you before they throw you away.

Figuring what to do is the hardest part. Followed of course by getting the capital needed to start the business. I would suggest doing something small on the side while still working at your day job and building it up over time. Go back to school\take courses if appropriate for whatever business you want to get into if that helps increase your ability to succeed (such as real estate course if you choose real estate for ex). You do not need to get an actual degree per se, just get knowledge in the field to help you succeed in your endeavor.
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Last edited by YanksIn2009 December 2, 2015 at 10:57 PM
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#3
Quote from YanksIn2009 View Post :
I sympathize and completely understand your frustration. I have said it before many times on this site to those looking to go into IT (or anything technical) these days...BAD choice. The simple fact of the matter is we do not build much of anything anymore in this country and many of the high tech jobs are being outsourced and you are competing with third world slave labor. Add in that as you get older and do make more money (and cost more), companies look to replace you with younger workers or workers overseas. That is unlikely to change and indeed it is likely to get worse.

IT in particular is one of the worst in this respect where they work you long hours, you go unappreciated in most cases and then you are discarded. The schools are generally just spouting propaganda for the industry to try to keep up the supply of cheap IT labor so as to help further the push out of the older workers. Ask yourself how many 60+ year old developers do you see these days...not a whole lot. That is not to say you can not succeed in IT, but the number of people that rise to some BS VP job are few and far between.

I worked in IT for many years rising to Director of Dev\Ops for a major application suite of a medium sized company. Got laid off with the rest of the place once they decided to outsource most everybody (IT, Customer Service, Accounts Payable, etc.) so I know of what I speak. They laid off almost everyone in IT over 40 some odd years old who was not some management crony as well. Fortunately I also had a business in real estate that I got into thanks to my parents and decided to just go full bore into that and screw IT.

As to what to do, I would look to get into business yourself doing something you find interesting\think you are good at. I know it is hard to throw away what you have spent the better part of your life pursuing, but trust me, it is the right thing to do in the long run. Not saying it will not be difficult and the path will not be littered with problems, but in the end you succeed or fail on your own merits, answerable to yourself and whoever else you go into business with and you will find it much more rewarding personally than taking orders from morons and a-holes just looking to see how much they can abuse you before they throw you away.

Figuring what to do is the hardest part. Followed of course by getting the capital needed to start the business. I would suggest doing something small on the side while still working at your day job and building it up over time. Go back to school\take courses if appropriate for whatever business you want to get into if that helps increase your ability to succeed (such as real estate course if you choose real estate for ex). You do not need to get an actual degree per se, just get knowledge in the field to help you succeed in your endeavor.

Thank you for your kind words of encouragement. I have a knack for being able to spot gaps in the market and have many ideas that could take advantage of that. I don't want to go back to school so I guess books and the internet are my best bet. The only other thing I ever saw myself taking akin to was Marketing ... Seems just as volatile at times though ... I honestly thought I could make it which is why I finished.... I also did better than a majority of the people in my classes which is why I thought that with the right opportunity ... I could make it.

My brother lives in Silicon Valley and is a finance director for a big company up there but we don't get along. Also he'd never let me live it down if he had helped me so I never considered him a resource....

Work in 8 hours ... I don't even feel like going in but we have an industry function tomorrow and I'm forced to. I feel like having an Office Space moment and just not going in.
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#4
Quote from Xplic1T View Post :
Thank you for your kind words of encouragement. I have a knack for being able to spot gaps in the market and have many ideas that could take advantage of that. I don't want to go back to school so I guess books and the internet are my best bet. The only other thing I ever saw myself taking akin to was Marketing ... Seems just as volatile at times though ... I honestly thought I could make it which is why I finished.... I also did better than a majority of the people in my classes which is why I thought that with the right opportunity ... I could make it.

My brother lives in Silicon Valley and is a finance director for a big company up there but we don't get along. Also he'd never let me live it down if he had helped me so I never considered him a resource....

Work in 8 hours ... I don't even feel like going in but we have an industry function tomorrow and I'm forced to. I feel like having an Office Space moment and just not going in.

Yeah I have been there. There were places I worked and people I worked with I just could not stand. Just total a-holes. When I was consulting in IT, I outright quit and walked away from a couple of contracts due to the BS they were handing out. I never was one to tolerate fools well lol.

Ones ability to succeed in IT has more to do with being lucky to fall into the right job\situation than anything else. Same in other fields, just worse in IT as politics and the personalities of the people you work with and the company you work for are important and the number of non-BS situations a lot less. Do not let it get you down or feel it is a flaw in yourself. It isn't. Unfortunately, when we are young we are too stupid and\or naive to understand how the real world really works. That may be cynical, but I am a pragmatist.

You will find most places are just populated by major jerks in management. I can honestly say that in all the years I worked in IT, the number of VPs I worked with that I had any respect for numbered 2. One was a VP of Credit that really knew his stuff and appreciated and understood what IT could do for him and had excellent common sense in its application and the other was an IT VP that was no-nonsense and technically adept. They both got laid off and outsourced as they fell out of political favor. All the others and all the PMs I ever worked with were just a bunch of morons of various degrees. The better ones were zeroes and knew enough to get out of the way of the people getting things done. The worst ones were net negatives requiring effort by others to undo the damage they caused.


Like I said, the best thing to do is to go into a business of your own doing something you are good at and have an interest in. It is not going to be easy and I would recommend doing some soul searching and coming up with a game plan that you can try to implement over the long term while you hold down your day job. Rental properties, open up a shop of sorts, online business, etc. Once you establish a plan, then you can take the attitude at work where you just do your job and do not let anything going on really bother you too much as you know it will be only for the short horizon. Once one recognizes that one's long term future is not with the company they work for, then you stop worrying about the politics, promotions, etc. and just collect your paycheck and go home at the end of the day knowing the ultimate goal is to establish the business to the point where you can make a living off it and ditch the day job. Again not an easy thing to do or succeed at but nothing worth something really ever is easy.
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#5
Quote from YanksIn2009 View Post :
I sympathize and completely understand your frustration. I have said it before many times on this site to those looking to go into IT (or anything technical) these days...BAD choice. The simple fact of the matter is we do not build much of anything anymore in this country and many of the high tech jobs are being outsourced and you are competing with third world slave labor. Add in that as you get older and do make more money (and cost more), companies look to replace you with younger workers or workers overseas. That is unlikely to change and indeed it is likely to get worse.
Wow. It's like we are not even in the same country. We are talking about the US right? In the Silicon Valley jobs are many and workers are few. It's so easy to get job in the valley. Pay seems high for freshouts, high five figures to six to start, but in the Bay Area that's basically minimum wage with $3500/month 1 bedroom apartments.

As for age discrimination. A friend of mine was laid off when his company failed this year. He's 50 years old. He got another job, with multiple offers, in less than 2 weeks. I was in tech since pretty much the start. Age discrimination seems to be getting less and less a factor. Yes, it was a young man's game but that was because everyone was young. We ain't no spring chickens anymore.
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#6
IT sucks. You get lured in by high salaries that top out fairly early in your career and then it is just a grind after that. You can't leave because nothing pays that well. Been there, done that, lost the passion some 15 years ago. Now I live for weekends and retirement. Try to get a fed job, at least then you can do whatever you want without fear of being fired or laid off. Try to move into LAN/WAN (Cisco/Juniper) or Databases. At least then you don't have to deal with as many idiots.
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#7
Quote from dealgate View Post :
IT sucks. You get lured in by high salaries that top out fairly early in your career and then it is just a grind after that. You can't leave because nothing pays that well. Been there, done that, lost the passion some 15 years ago. Now I live for weekends and retirement.
Did you read my mind Wink

To the OP, you're going through frankly something that I would think most adults have gone through, will go through, or are going through. Work is work, most people don't do it because they want to but because they need/have to. Try and find something that you enjoy that keeps you in the lifestyle that you also are ok with. It's a balancing act and frankly something you hate now may be something you love with a different company. I'd love to be a suntan lotion tester but I doubt that pays very well. The older you get a lot of time the more responsibilities you have meaning the less flexible you can be with jumping to a new field so I'd suggest to find something you like when you're young but also keep an eye out for other things as something that you love can quickly turn to something that you don't like. There is no shame whatsoever in hopping around a bit company wise, field wise. Hell, in the IT field it's frankly expected. If you've stayed at the same company for 20 years doing the same thing a lot of people I know wonder about you and why you've done that. Must be because you're a slacker but they're afraid to fire you!

Best of luck and remember to see the good in things. Depression sucks major ass and simply stopping to look at a sunset, enjoy a nicer than average meal, taking a random day off for no reason, etc. can make a big difference over time.
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Last edited by LivninSC December 3, 2015 at 09:44 AM
#8
I think you just haven't found a good fit for an employer. I've been working in various IT roles since high school. Never graduated college (although I went back and am almost done now). I worked first level phone tech support for a fortune 500 and I hated life. Pay was pretty good but inane changes by higher ups were killing me not to mention first level phone support just sucks since you're chained to your desk. And then the bureaucracy of large public companies is crazy. A job or two after that and I'm the Director of IT at a non-profit. Good pay, great environment and hours, low stress and I get to do all sorts of things since it's me and 2 other guys. If your looking for a specialization, I think I'd look into security, although that's always a money issue at every company (they don't want to spend it). I'm 35 now and pretty happy with my situation. I'd keep looking until you can find a company that's a good fit for you. There is no job that is a golden ticket. In the wrong work environment any job will suck. If you need to re-ignite your passion, perhaps try picking up some sort of side project you enjoy doing in your off time. Or just get a hobby you really enjoy. You don't have to live to work, maybe a better option is to work to live.
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#9
Perhaps use your off work time reading books of different fields with the goal in mind to develop interest in different fields. Then go back to school to get a degree in the field you like and perhaps the multi-displine education background will make it more meaningful for the job you do after you graduate.

It's nice that you have this realization about your career choices when you are still young. I don't think you need to envy your classmates who are doing the management stuff. It's probably more boring and demoralizing than your current jobs are.
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#10
I have taken all of your comments to heart and have decided that I need to take some time to find myself. I know it wasn't the most prudent move but i really couldn't take it anymore today during this dog and pony show we had.

I've accrued enough savings to live off for 8 to 10 months and will take this time to find myself and hopefully something more meaningful.
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Last edited by Xplic1T December 3, 2015 at 10:39 PM
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#11
Best of luck man.
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#12
Sounds like a good plan. I definitely wouldn't run out to get a new degree and accrue debt.
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#13
No offense, but some of the general comments about working in IT seem a bit misplaced. Yes, a lot of the positions in the IT field have been outsourced and the options are more limited than they were. Yes, many companies don't value IT (until something goes wrong of course). Yes, in many companies it can be a thankless role where you're rarely appreciated and often blamed. But if you are willing to deal with those possible challenges, have a good well rounded skill-set, are willing to continue your education and evolve your abilities, you can often get a very lucrative job that gives you enjoyment and interesting challenges.

I've worked in IT related positions for about 15 years now. Everything from help desk to system/network admin to engineer to management. After getting to an SVP role in a medium sized company, I realized how much I dislike management (project management is fine, people management, not so much) and decided to transition to a different role in a different company with a much larger emphasis on network and security engineering. I actually make more, work for an exponentially better company and am much happier with what I do. But I digress...

In my current role, I'm often brought into existing companies as a consultant to help with larger and more advanced projects. And what I've seen more often than not with the in-house IT people is a severe lack of motivation and an old and stale skill-set. People who entered the IT field years ago, got a job and stopped trying to learn new things. Maybe the company they worked for hindered their motivation, but they accepted that and decided to stay anyway. If and when they decide to leave, they'll find it very hard to get a job somewhere else when they find out that, outside of transitioning to a similar role in a similar company in a similar industry with similar equipment, they are simply not qualified.

And let's face it. Many people who work in IT simply aren't that qualified to begin with. They understand computers and maybe some basic networking, etc., but just because they enjoy tinkering around with a home lab in their spare time does not mean that they can perform the needs of a business. Or, just as importantly, that they would enjoy it. Playing at home and working with mission critical systems is different. Many IT schools churn out under-qualified graduates that don't have any practical knowledge or experience and are surprised when their degree simply qualifies them to get a job at a helpdesk level. No matter how smart you are, it takes time and effort (and continuing education) to be good in IT -- or any field. The flood of people, qualified or not, who decide to work in IT also make it difficult to get a good job since it's difficult for companies that don't have a large IT staff, and people to make good hiring choices, to filter out the chaff from the wheat.

Speaking of other fields, the same arguments made here against IT apply there as well. Most people aren't excited to go to their jobs, feel under-appreciated and underpaid, think management is idiotic and consider themselves trapped. Even in some of the more prestigious careers people often find hardships. Take lawyers for example. Contrary to popular belief, most aren't very successful. After spending a ton of time and money in school, graduating, passing the bar, and finding a job, they have to grind away for years working 80+ hour weeks getting shit on by all the higher-ups. Only the top people really 'make it'. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't consider being a an attorney if you love the law. And let's be honest, when it comes to high paying jobs without the requirement of advanced formal education, IT jobs are at the top of the list.

IT encompasses a lot. And many of the positions have little to do with one another. Just because you aren't happy in one specific field doesn't mean you might not enjoy another. Help desk always sucks, but it can provide a lot of real world experience and get your foot in the door. But from a career path, you have system administration, network engineering, security (which has a slew of sub-fields), database administration, development, VoIP, virtualization, etc. The list goes on and on. And what field your company is in has a huge impact on specializations (healthcare, financial, manufacturing, etc).

For someone going into IT, a good idea is to work for a company that provides hands-on experience with most of those things so you can figure out what, if anything, you like most and aim for that as your career. But most importantly, learn everything you can about everything. Working for a (good) MSP can be a great way to expand your skillset exponentially and learning what you like best.

In the end, working in IT is certainly not easy. And it may not be for everyone. It takes a lot of hard work and constant continuing education -- what you know today will be useless in a few years and what's 'hot' today will be cold tomorrow. And yes, it certainly takes a bit of luck to work for the right company. But to say that IT in general is a horrible field to get into is, in my opinion and experience, simply not true.

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#14
Quote from phonic View Post :
No offense, but some of the general comments about working in IT seem a bit misplaced. Yes, a lot of the positions in the IT field have been outsourced and the options are more limited than they were. Yes, many companies don't value IT (until something goes wrong of course). Yes, in many companies it can be a thankless role where you're rarely appreciated and often blamed. But if you are willing to deal with those possible challenges, have a good well rounded skill-set, are willing to continue your education and evolve your abilities, you can often get a very lucrative job that gives you enjoyment and interesting challenges.

I've worked in IT related positions for about 15 years now. Everything from help desk to system/network admin to engineer to management. After getting to an SVP role in a medium sized company, I realized how much I dislike management (project management is fine, people management, not so much) and decided to transition to a different role in a different company with a much larger emphasis on network and security engineering. I actually make more, work for an exponentially better company and am much happier with what I do. But I digress...

In my current role, I'm often brought into existing companies as a consultant to help with larger and more advanced projects. And what I've seen more often than not with the in-house IT people is a severe lack of motivation and an old and stale skill-set. People who entered the IT field years ago, got a job and stopped trying to learn new things. Maybe the company they worked for hindered their motivation, but they accepted that and decided to stay anyway. If and when they decide to leave, they'll find it very hard to get a job somewhere else when they find out that, outside of transitioning to a similar role in a similar company in a similar industry with similar equipment, they are simply not qualified.

And let's face it. Many people who work in IT simply aren't that qualified to begin with. They understand computers and maybe some basic networking, etc., but just because they enjoy tinkering around with a home lab in their spare time does not mean that they can perform the needs of a business. Or, just as importantly, that they would enjoy it. Playing at home and working with mission critical systems is different. Many IT schools churn out under-qualified graduates that don't have any practical knowledge or experience and are surprised when their degree simply qualifies them to get a job at a helpdesk level. No matter how smart you are, it takes time and effort (and continuing education) to be good in IT -- or any field. The flood of people, qualified or not, who decide to work in IT also make it difficult to get a good job since it's difficult for companies that don't have a large IT staff, and people to make good hiring choices, to filter out the chaff from the wheat.

Speaking of other fields, the same arguments made here against IT apply there as well. Most people aren't excited to go to their jobs, feel under-appreciated and underpaid, think management is idiotic and consider themselves trapped. Even in some of the more prestigious careers people often find hardships. Take lawyers for example. Contrary to popular belief, most aren't very successful. After spending a ton of time and money in school, graduating, passing the bar, and finding a job, they have to grind away for years working 80+ hour weeks getting shit on by all the higher-ups. Only the top people really 'make it'. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't consider being a an attorney if you love the law. And let's be honest, when it comes to high paying jobs without the requirement of advanced formal education, IT jobs are at the top of the list.

IT encompasses a lot. And many of the positions have little to do with one another. Just because you aren't happy in one specific field doesn't mean you might not enjoy another. Help desk always sucks, but it can provide a lot of real world experience and get your foot in the door. But from a career path, you have system administration, network engineering, security (which has a slew of sub-fields), database administration, development, VoIP, virtualization, etc. The list goes on and on. And what field your company is in has a huge impact on specializations (healthcare, financial, manufacturing, etc).

For someone going into IT, a good idea is to work for a company that provides hands-on experience with most of those things so you can figure out what, if anything, you like most and aim for that as your career. But most importantly, learn everything you can about everything. Working for a (good) MSP can be a great way to expand your skillset exponentially and learning what you like best.

In the end, working in IT is certainly not easy. And it may not be for everyone. It takes a lot of hard work and constant continuing education -- what you know today will be useless in a few years and what's 'hot' today will be cold tomorrow. And yes, it certainly takes a bit of luck to work for the right company. But to say that IT in general is a horrible field to get into is, in my opinion and experience, simply not true.


First off as I stated before, imo 80% of the people in IT are incompetent. And given the way management almost universally treats IT people (long hours, no respect or appreciation, etc) why would you expect the remaining
20% that are competent to continue to be "motivated" to do any thing? Most of them will just collect a check and move on as is human nature. When you treat people like trash, why would you expect to them to do anything extra (unless of course they want to find another job soon lol).

There is one almost universal constant in IT...namely horrid, uncaring, total inept management. I consulted in many places and worked in a number of firms over the years and almost without exception senior management was a bunch of imbeciles and jerks whose primary concern was how big their bonus would be at the expense of everyone else. And I have not even touched on how they will outsource the last developer they have if they thought it would get them a bigger bonus 6 months from now (I have seen this done first hand more than once).

As to your situation, just because you left upper management and found something rewarding does not mean most can either rise to SVP (almost impossible) or become a highly paid consultant in his field. It is not impossible to succeed obviously, but anyone recommending IT really should think twice about the potential damage they do to others offering flawed career advise imo. The field is littered with morons, offers long hours and relatively moderate pay, horrible work environments\appreciation factors, has low job satisfaction for most and people are dumped when they get older by and large unless they are connected.

Yes the propaganda machine that is the industry will tout the inevitable "Well I made it so you can... I have a friend who works in Silicon Valley who makes a boat load, etc." lines in the schools and elsewhere, but the reality of it is that there are very few upper management positions and even fewer companies that treat people well by and large in the industry and those in upper management that are around are also usually politicians by and large, something that most IT folks tend to not be good at by nature since they actually are trained to get something done and not go golfing with the boss and stick their head up his rear at every opportunity.

My 2 cents.
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Getting good job you love is luck for the most part. My friend who has a random degree not even related to IT is a team lead in an IT job making 75k a year and loves it. He gets all federal holiday off, plus 2 weeks paid vacation for Christmas. What did he do to get that job? Get lucky. That is about it.

Quote from YanksIn2009 View Post :
First off as I stated before, imo 80% of the people in IT are incompetent. And given the way management almost universally treats IT people (long hours, no respect or appreciation, etc) why would you expect the remaining
20% that are competent to continue to be "motivated" to do any thing? Most of them will just collect a check and move on as is human nature. When you treat people like trash, why would you expect to them to do anything extra (unless of course they want to find another job soon lol).

There is one almost universal constant in IT...namely horrid, uncaring, total inept management. I consulted in many places and worked in a number of firms over the years and almost without exception senior management was a bunch of imbeciles and jerks whose primary concern was how big their bonus would be at the expense of everyone else. And I have not even touched on how they will outsource the last developer they have if they thought it would get them a bigger bonus 6 months from now (I have seen this done first hand more than once).

As to your situation, just because you left upper management and found something rewarding does not mean most can either rise to SVP (almost impossible) or become a highly paid consultant in his field. It is not impossible to succeed obviously, but anyone recommending IT really should think twice about the potential damage they do to others offering flawed career advise imo. The field is littered with morons, offers long hours and relatively moderate pay, horrible work environments\appreciation factors, has low job satisfaction for most and people are dumped when they get older by and large unless they are connected.

Yes the propaganda machine that is the industry will tout the inevitable "Well I made it so you can... I have a friend who works in Silicon Valley who makes a boat load, etc." lines in the schools and elsewhere, but the reality of it is that there are very few upper management positions and even fewer companies that treat people well by and large in the industry and those in upper management that are around are also usually politicians by and large, something that most IT folks tend to not be good at by nature since they actually are trained to get something done and not go golfing with the boss and stick their head up his rear at every opportunity.

My 2 cents.
The sad fact is no one wants to believe their ass hole boss got there by luck because that completely invalidates the system.
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Last edited by The-Alchemist December 4, 2015 at 10:22 PM
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