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100 mbps fiber service

GeTinThere007 152 20 December 15, 2015 at 12:22 PM
I got a quote from an ISP for fiber to my business. However they are saying that I would be responsible for cross connecting from my floor (19th floor) to the main data center of the building (3rd floor). How does that make any sense? Why can't they just use the existing data runs?

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#2
The landlord may not let them, talk to the landlord and see what is existing
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Quote from GeTinThere007 View Post :
I got a quote from an ISP for fiber to my business. However they are saying that I would be responsible for cross connecting from my floor (19th floor) to the main data center of the building (3rd floor). How does that make any sense? Why can't they just use the existing data runs?
If only it could be that simple.

From my experience with Pacific Bell [I'm dating myself] whenever cabling regardless of type, copper or fiber. As the cabling passes from one floor to the next or from one room to the next room there is a fireproof transit or cable hole location on both the ceiling [floor 3] and on the floor [floor 4] and on both sides of a wall.

I am not aware of any company that does the smart thing and run cabling specifically for future use, of course they would need a crystal ball to know what will be needed in the future. It is doubtful that any existing cabling is unused.

Creating a reliable fireproof transit or cable hole is expensive (materials + labor) and requires a trained and certified person that is willing to take personal responsibility for that transit until it is opened again and someone else assumes that responsibility.

Running cabling regardless of type is not just a pull it from the ground floor to the 19th floor and off we go. Business's have other regulations they are required to meet, racks to carry or support the cables and the cables themselves must be tied down {in California} every 12 inches all along the run. The string and each individual knot they use to tie the cables in place must be certified too.

Sorry if this answer seems long but I don't know shorthand.
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Last edited by dale_101798 December 15, 2015 at 06:41 PM
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#4
Quote from dale_101798 View Post :
If only it could be that simple.

From my experience with Pacific Bell [I'm dating myself] whenever cabling regardless of type, copper or fiber. As the cabling passes from one floor to the next or from one room to the next room there is a fireproof transit or cable hole location on both the ceiling [floor 3] and on the floor [floor 4] and on both sides of a wall.

I am not aware of any company that does the smart thing and run cabling specifically for future use, of course they would need a crystal ball to know what will be needed in the future. It is doubtful that any existing cabling is unused.

Creating a reliable fireproof transit or cable hole is expensive (materials + labor) and requires a trained and certified person that is willing to take personal responsibility for that transit until it is opened again and someone else assumes that responsibility.

Running cabling regardless of type is not just a pull it from the ground floor to the 19th floor and off we go. Business's have other regulations they are required to meet, racks to carry or support the cables and the cables themselves must be tied down {in California} every 12 inches all along the run. The string and each individual knot they use to tie the cables in place must be certified too.

Sorry if this answer seems long but I don't know shorthand.
Thanks for the detailed reply. It makes sense, it just seems like a company would include that work in their service price. I think the industry is due for a disruptive company that actually provides all-in-one services.
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Quote from GeTinThere007 View Post :
Thanks for the detailed reply. It makes sense, it just seems like a company would include that work in their service price. I think the industry is due for a disruptive company that actually provides all-in-one services.
Pretty much every utility has some type of demarcation point where the cable, pipe, etc that's coming into your house or business stops being their responsibility. In the case of a house, it's often a box on the side of the house and while it's not their responsibility they often install the wires that enter your house in a manner that's convenient for them (and often ugly).

In an office building, it makes sense that this demarcation point would be some type of central location in the building and a lower floor makes sense. As to the particulars of what's in the building, talk to the landlord and look over your lease carefully. That's where you'll find your answers. If there's existing phone wiring that isn't in use, there's a chance it was run with cat 5e. If new wires need to be run, try to convince some other businesses to install the wires/fiber at the same time, it could reduce the cost.

How do you connect to the internet currently (who do you pay, what speed is it, and how does it get to your office)?
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Last edited by jkee December 15, 2015 at 11:26 PM
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Quote from jkee View Post :
Pretty much every utility has some type of demarcation point where the cable, pipe, etc that's coming into your house or business stops being their responsibility. In the case of a house, it's often a box on the side of the house and while it's not their responsibility they often install the wires that enter your house in a manner that's convenient for them (and often ugly).

In an office building, it makes sense that this demarcation point would be some type of central location in the building and a lower floor makes sense. As to the particulars of what's in the building, talk to the landlord and look over your lease carefully. That's where you'll find your answers. If there's existing phone wiring that isn't in use, there's a chance it was run with cat 5e. If new wires need to be run, try to convince some other businesses to install the wires/fiber at the same time, it could reduce the cost.

How do you connect to the internet currently (who do you pay, what speed is it, and how does it get to your office)?
This is the right answer. The ISP is responsible to the demarcation point, or MPOP. If they run the line from there to you, they are then responsible for that line. My guess is you can use the existing lines but the ISP just doesn't want to be responsible. I would also think there were pull strings installed when the building was core drilled for datacomm services. This should be an easy matter to get you connected.
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just drill a hole and run it on the outside that is what comcast always does.
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Depending on the type of building (my experience is in data centers), there may also be an NRC and MRC for the cross-connect, that's paid by the initiating party. Could be part of the reason the ISP wants you to do it.
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I would ask the ISP to include that in their bid to make it go where you want. I just went through a fiber bid and install and they asked where I wanted to put it. When we built the building we put the DMARC in the server room and built empty conduit to the box on the outside of the building to the server room so it would be easy to add services in the future.
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Quote from dealgate View Post :
This is the right answer. The ISP is responsible to the demarcation point, or MPOP. If they run the line from there to you, they are then responsible for that line. My guess is you can use the existing lines but the ISP just doesn't want to be responsible. I would also think there were pull strings installed when the building was core drilled for datacomm services. This should be an easy matter to get you connected.
For a businesses practical use this is not helpful though. Thanks for getting the service to the demarc but if my office is not on the same floor, that is useless to me. I want to pay for the internet service AND I expect you to bring it all the way to where I am essentially. I don't think that is a strange expectation. imo
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Quote from jkee View Post :
Pretty much every utility has some type of demarcation point where the cable, pipe, etc that's coming into your house or business stops being their responsibility. In the case of a house, it's often a box on the side of the house and while it's not their responsibility they often install the wires that enter your house in a manner that's convenient for them (and often ugly).

In an office building, it makes sense that this demarcation point would be some type of central location in the building and a lower floor makes sense. As to the particulars of what's in the building, talk to the landlord and look over your lease carefully. That's where you'll find your answers. If there's existing phone wiring that isn't in use, there's a chance it was run with cat 5e. If new wires need to be run, try to convince some other businesses to install the wires/fiber at the same time, it could reduce the cost.

How do you connect to the internet currently (who do you pay, what speed is it, and how does it get to your office)?
New wires need to be run. We connect with cat5, pay our current isp, 25mbps, and it comes to our 19th floor office from a riser in the ceiling. We want to upgrade to fiber, 100mbps with a different isp.
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#12
This is how its always been done, they run it to the building and you provide the rest. We had the same thing done to one of our data centers where ATT dropped a fiber run, did some tests to ensure a good connection and handed it off to us. Unforunately the network team didn't think to ask about having it ran straight to where our DC was located.
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Quote from GeTinThere007 View Post :
For a businesses practical use this is not helpful though. Thanks for getting the service to the demarc but if my office is not on the same floor, that is useless to me. I want to pay for the internet service AND I expect you to bring it all the way to where I am essentially. I don't think that is a strange expectation. imo
Nevertheless, this is how it works.
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Quote from GeTinThere007 View Post :
New wires need to be run. We connect with cat5, pay our current isp, 25mbps, and it comes to our 19th floor office from a riser in the ceiling. We want to upgrade to fiber, 100mbps with a different isp.
Cat-5 can handle 100Mbps...

The current ISP probably doesn't own the current cable, which most likely goes the the PDC on the 3rd floor. Talk to the landlord and read the lease, there's a pretty good chance you'll be able to use the existing cable.
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Quote from jkee View Post :
Cat-5 can handle 100Mbps...

The current ISP probably doesn't own the current cable, which most likely goes the the PDC on the 3rd floor. Talk to the landlord and read the lease, there's a pretty good chance you'll be able to use the existing cable.
Yeah, but we want fiber so we cant use the existing cable.
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