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Network experts - need your help

Conformer101 6,694 3,011 February 5, 2016 at 08:45 AM
Someone do a sanity check here:

It's my understanding that some 802.11n (older) devices solely use the 2.4Ghz band, correct?

Now, assuming that's the case, if I'm running a simultaneous dual band router, and I have these three devices attempting to connect:

(1) an old 802.11g device
(2) an old 802.11n device only capable of using the 2.4Ghz band
(3) a new 802.11n device capable of using 2.4Ghz or 5Ghz

then, the new 802.11n 5Ghz device's data rate will not be affected, but the 2.4Ghz channel will be downgraded to G speeds. Correct?

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#2
Speeds are as strong as the weakest link. Only the wireless-G device should be downgraded to G speeds.
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#3
From my understanding yes your correct. Slowest speed wins, per frequency/radio as it's the most compatible. I had a dual router setup for a while to get around something like this. Put the old slower clients on the second router, left the main router run the faster clients.
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#4
802.11n devices are backward compatible with older protocols. 5Ghz devices will only be supported by other [router] devices that support 5Ghz. The same thing applies to the newer AC protocol.
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#5
Quote from LiquidRetro View Post :
From my understanding yes your correct. Slowest speed wins, per frequency/radio as it's the most compatible. I had a dual router setup for a while to get around something like this. Put the old slower clients on the second router, left the main router run the faster clients.
To be more specific, my buddy is running an Asus RT-N66R router (simultaneous dual band). I believe he has all three types of client devices in his network. More importantly, I believe he is running a G-only bridge (wirelessly connected to that Asus router). When he first mentioned this to me, I started thinking that he may be inadvertently reducing the speed on any older N-only devices that can only run on 2.4Ghz.
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#6
Quote from Conformer101 View Post :
To be more specific, my buddy is running an Asus RT-N66R router (simultaneous dual band). I believe he has all three types of client devices in his network. More importantly, I believe he is running a G-only bridge (wirelessly connected to that Asus router). When he first mentioned this to me, I started thinking that he may be inadvertently reducing the speed on any older N-only devices that can only run on 2.4Ghz.
Your right, if the G and N are on the same AP, everything would run at G speed. In this setup I would let the 66R run 1 5ghz N, 1 2.4ghz N only, then run the 2nd router as G only (Wired if possible) as wireless bridges cut the bandwidth in half.
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#7
Quote from LiquidRetro View Post :
Your right, if the G and N are on the same AP, everything would run at G speed. In this setup I would let the 66R run 1 5ghz N, 1 2.4ghz N only, then run the 2nd router as G only (Wired if possible) as wireless bridges cut the bandwidth in half.
Yep, if we are correct, he needs to run a completely separate G network (router) on a separate channel, wired directly to his Asus, and bridge to that.

He's been running this config for some time now, and is constantly complaining about data rate. Hmmmm ....
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#8
Quote from Conformer101 View Post :
Yep, if we are correct, he needs to run a completely separate G network (router) on a separate channel, wired directly to his Asus, and bridge to that.

He's been running this config for some time now, and is constantly complaining about data rate. Hmmmm ....
Easy to test, Take the slowest G device offline, take the bridge offline, and reboot the main router to "reset" things. If things improve you have found your answer.
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#9
Quote from LiquidRetro View Post :
Easy to test, Take the slowest G device offline, take the bridge offline, and reboot the main router to "reset" things. If things improve you have found your answer.
.. or just temporarily force his Asus to only accept N connections (which he should do for the permanent solution anyway).
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Last edited by Conformer101 February 5, 2016 at 10:16 AM
#10
Why not just dump the g access point? Pretty worthless these days and an n-based one is fairly inexpensive.
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#11
Quote from YanksIn2009 View Post :
Why not just dump the g access point? Pretty worthless these days and an n-based one is fairly inexpensive.
He has several old g-only devices.
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#12
Quote from Conformer101 View Post :
He has several old g-only devices.

If they are laptops, then a wireless n adapter is cheap enough. If it is anything else, I can't imagine they are still worth using these days. Wireless n has been around for almost 10 years now.
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#13
Quote from dale_101798 View Post :
802.11n devices are backward compatible with older protocols. 5Ghz devices will only be supported by other [router] devices that support 5Ghz. The same thing applies to the newer AC protocol.
Do you ever bother to read the OP?
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#14
Quote from Conformer101 View Post :
Someone do a sanity check here:

It's my understanding that some 802.11n (older) devices solely use the 2.4Ghz band, correct?

Now, assuming that's the case, if I'm running a simultaneous dual band router, and I have these three devices attempting to connect:

(1) an old 802.11g device
(2) an old 802.11n device only capable of using the 2.4Ghz band
(3) a new 802.11n device capable of using 2.4Ghz or 5Ghz

then, the new 802.11n 5Ghz device's data rate will not be affected, but the 2.4Ghz channel will be downgraded to G speeds. Correct?
Mostly correct, but the 2.4 isn't strictly speaking 'downgraded'. Here is a good laymans explanation:
https://discussions.apple.com/mes...4#22602414

Quote :
On a mixed-mode network (e.g. backwards compatible), devices capable of connecting at 11n will do so, while devices able to connect at 11g will do the same. So long as only one device is communicating with the router, things should be fine. The problem arises with "simultaneous" communication situations. While the details are perhaps overly technical, the bottom line is that a number of network "gymnastics" ensue to ensure that both devices can communicate in a stable manner, without data loss, etc. The real world implications of this can result in as much as 30% drop in speed compared to the theoretical maximum, but that tends to be extreme (e.g. one device is making constant requests for data, such as streaming, etc).
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