http://www.menstech.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/chrome_wii.jpg
12/15/08

US - Nintendo continued its console dominance with a shocking sales total of 2.04 million systems sold in November. At the same time, the Wii made major gains against the combined force of HD systems 360 and PS3.

After a full year on sale in November 2007, it appeared the HD systems would fend off the sensational sales of the Wii with landmark sales of their own.

As both the 360 and the PS3 shared an extremely common library outside of several marquis exclusives, one could observe the strategy of 3rd parties favoring the higher-powered systems with multi-platform hardcore titles while pushing sub-standard shovelware onto the Wii audience.

And you could see why, too. The audience for the HD systems is clearly an older set than what many presume the Mario Kart audience is, and most 3rd parties are still marketing primarily to the older group.

Beyond that, the combined total of the 360 and PS3 in the US outpaced the Wii by almost five and half million as late as March of this year (60% market share). With the difference in audience, HD system's sales lead, and more viable options for after-the-purchase revenue streams (DLC), 3rd parties really haven't had a choice.

This month does not erase everything, but it certainly will raise the eyebrows of 3rd parties that haven't yet taken the Wii audience seriously. In the past eight months the Wii has lowered the HD lead by two-and-a-quarter million units, a million of that in the last month alone. How 3rd parties respond to that, or if they do at all, remains to be seen.

Questions for consumption down below.

http://images.redial.net/2-NPD-monthly-totals-1108.png

http://images.redial.net/3-NPD-monthly-LTD-1108.png

http://images.redial.net/4-NPD-MS-PIE-1108.png

http://images.redial.net/5-NPD-MS-LINE-1108.png

Questions for Consumption
1. Will Wii LTD ever pass the combined total of the HD systems in the US? When? Does it matter?

2. Will Japanese 3rd party exclusives like Monster Hunter 3 and Dragon Quest X significantly alter the race in the United States?

3. Wii Western Publishers see the significant Japanese exclusives and return volley with their own?

4. Will the certain addition of jRPG-enthusiasts from MH3 and DQX mean even more jRPGs for the Wii?

5. Considering the current Western 3rd party struggles on the Wii as well as the acknowledged difference in audience, is the Wii a viable option for 3rd parties to publish traditional harder-core games?

source (http://chartget.blogspot.com/2008/12/november-2008-npd-console-comparison.html)

i'll believe it when i see it.
I still don't see majority of gamers actually want to interact to play a game.
I'd rather just be my lazy self and sit with a normal controller without doing anything else lol

Call of Duty: WaW sales:

360- 2.6 million
PS3- 1.5 million
Wii- 220,000

'nuff said

Yet while Nintendo's first-party Wii software rakes in the cash, most third party games fail to make an impact on the charts. Activision's Guitar Hero: World Tour marks a notable exception, as the Wii version handily outsold the Xbox 360, PS2, and PS3 SKUs.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3171916

Nuff said.

5. Considering the current Western 3rd party struggles on the Wii as well as the acknowledged difference in audience, is the Wii a viable option for 3rd parties to publish traditional harder-core games?

Yep, I know when I think hard-core games Guitar Hero is the first thing that pops into my mind...

This is from some sketchy "news" blog, and we're supposed to take @ face value? Saw this on N4G a while ago, but it's BS.

Call of Duty: WaW sales:

360- 2.6 million
PS3- 1.5 million
Wii- 220,000

'nuff said

The Wii base doesn't play war games. Its for the casual gamer. I guarantee you Wii Fit has a higher combined total than the best selling 360/PS3 game.

The Wii base doesn't play war games. Its for the casual gamer. I guarantee you Wii Fit has a higher combined total than the best selling 360/PS3 game.

Nope. Wii Fad (oops, Fit) sold 2.1 million globally (as of November 19), whereas Madden (Wii version) sold 3 million globally (Source (http://www.pcworld.com/article/153947/madden_wii_fit_lead_global_game_sales.html)). Gears of War 2 (out since late-mid November only) has already sold 2 million (Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gears_of_war_2#Sales)).

Don't know why people seem to have the mistaken impression that Wii games sell well. They don't. The hardware sells pretty well, but the average attach rate is very low (this may have something to do with the abysmal average Metacritic of Wii games). The Wii is regularly the smallest revenue-generating platform for publishers (e.g. Take-Two -- see my thread on this forum).

The Wii base doesn't play war games. Its for the casual gamer. I guarantee you Wii Fit has a higher combined total than the best selling 360/PS3 game.


Did you actually read the article? It is saying that the Wii is closing the large gap in installed systems that the 360+PS3 had. It is questioning that if it continues to close this gap, will companies that previously didn't make games for the Wii start trying to bring more "hard-core" games to the Wii to take advantage of it's large user base.

So WTF do sales of a game used by lardass soccer moms to do yoga have to do w/ anything? Yes, the Fit has sold very well...it's perfect for it's target audience. It's target audience is casual gamers, as you said, not hardcore gamers. So it really has nothing to do w/ this article, now does it?

It says "Wii cuts deeply into HD Lead" NOT hardcore lead. I don't know where you're getting the "hardcore gamer" thing from.

All you have to do is wait a few months to see how Conduit, MadWorld, and HotD:Overkill sell...

Call of Duty: WaW sales:

360- 2.6 million
PS3- 1.5 million
Wii- 220,000

'nuff said

For what its worth I just beat the campaign mode and it makes for a very satisfying experience with the Wii Zapper. But the graphics, of course, left much to be desired.

I am a very casual gamer but the last 3 games I played....they released titles on the xbox 360 and not on the WII and they wont either for the WII b/c it just cant handle the graphics. Two being Command and Conquer Kane's Wrath, Red Alert 3.

I played the WII and have no idea what the big fuss is about. It's mainly for really young kids, women, and elderly who can play, say bowling.

I find the article misleading and worthless without talking about how most top selling games are not playabe onthe WII

I own a Wii and a 360. Don't have a PS3 for reasons best left for another thread.

Let me say straight out that "hardcore gamers" will never be satisfied with a Wii. However, adults like myself find it rather entertaining. Those of us with girlfriends/wives/families can find ways to play with our families as opposed to always just playing with ourselves.

As fun as it is to play GoW2 or CoD:WaW or whatever against some 15Yo in Estovakia who thinks he's l33t because he's yet to have a job, it doesn't mean it isn't also fun to step onto the Wii fit and snowboard against the girlfriend.

The whole "which system is better" argument is just a joke. They are different systems for different markets. Sure there is a TON of shovelware on the Wii but I don't buy it. I buy games that are fun and that the girlfriend wants to play (because the more she likes the Wii, the more understanding she is of games in general and thus about my 360). However there is a ton of crap on the 360 and PS3 as well. Do I really need 14,082 FPS'? Heck no. Does that mean that my 360 blows because it's too FPS oriented? No, because I played the hell out of the Lego games and Saints Row and GTA and so forth. Different boats and all that.

If you don't like the Wii then go back to playing GoW2 against aforementioned Estovakian l33t kids. Likewise if you don't like the 360/PS3 then step onto the Wii Fit (don't jump on it) and Yoga or bowl your heart out. Just enjoy what you enjoy and grow up enough to let others enjoy what they want. That's call a free market.

/rant.

It says "Wii cuts deeply into HD Lead" NOT hardcore lead. I don't know where you're getting the "hardcore gamer" thing from.

I guess I got it from reading...let me know when you get to that part of the article.

5. Considering the current Western 3rd party struggles on the Wii as well as the acknowledged difference in audience, is the Wii a viable option for 3rd parties to publish traditional harder-core games?

For what its worth I just beat the campaign mode and it makes for a very satisfying experience with the Wii Zapper. But the graphics, of course, left much to be desired.


Interesting, We have a Zapper from a zombie game, might be fun to rent COD just to see what it's like. Force Unleased was not bad on the Wii, either...enjoyed using the wiimote as a lightsaber, but I played it after beating it on PS3 so the graphics were meh in comparison, as well.

Force Unleased was not bad on the Wii, either...enjoyed using the wiimote as a lightsaber

Lol...check out Zero Punctuation's review of Wii Force Unleashed. (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/251-Star-Wars-The-Force-Unleashed) "The slight graphical downgrade [on the Wii] became 'it looks like it was left in a swamp monster's pocket during laundry day'". Dunno -- played it on the 360 and I've seen it on the Wii and it...wow...looks awful.

Some games are wonderful with the Wiimote, some games aren't. Pretty easy to predict what kind of games will succeed on which system.

Wii - Needs a better attach rate. Not selling enough games/console. Many people are sitting around with Wii Sports and Mario Kart with little interest in the other games.

PS3 - Needs to start matching 360 software sales on games that are sold for both systems. Many cross platforms games are over 2:1 for the 360, which is unreal after looking at each company a few years ago.

360 - Needs to further cut into the casual market. Not sure if they will succeed here.

Some games are wonderful with the Wiimote, some games aren't. Pretty easy to predict what kind of games will succeed on which system.

Wii - Needs a better attach rate. Not selling enough games/console. Many people are sitting around with Wii Sports and Mario Kart with little interest in the other games.

PS3 - Needs to start matching 360 software sales on games that are sold for both systems. Many cross platforms games are over 2:1 for the 360, which is unreal after looking at each company a few years ago.

360 - Needs to further cut into the casual market. Not sure if they will succeed here.

I agree with everything other than the Wii part. Mario Galaxy and Brawl sold incredibly well. Nintendo is for the most part delivering on their end in terms of software (despite your feeling about wii sports, wii fit and wii music). It's the 3rd party developers continually put shovelware and half assed ports on the system.

Mario Galaxy and Brawl sold incredibly well

Wouldn't go quite that far. Anyway, you can't take anecdotal evidence like that and make the case that the Wii sells software well. Because it just doesn't. For example, it would be stupid if I were to tell you that the Xbox 360 is a great software mover because Gears 2 has sold 2 million so far -- because there's far more than one game out there.

The point is that besides Wii Sports (I've never understood why this counts as a game sale anyway, since it comes with the console), the Wii is terrible at moving software. That is partly due to extremely poor third-party support, partly due to Nintendo's own policy of not releasing new entries in their proven franchise until the old ones stop selling, and partly due to poor corporate policy (e.g. not telling major 3rd-party developers about the WiiMotionPlus until they found out at E3).

You can cite any anecdotal, personal evidence you like, but the reality is that the Wii's attach rate is in the toilet. It has 5.5 games/console (remember that this, for some reason, includes Wii Sports, so is really 4.5), whereas the 360 has 8.1 (Source (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/ps3-has-lowest-console-attach-rate)). The PS3 is, admittedly, slightly behind the Wii. But you can't say that Nintendo's machine is great at selling games. It just isn't.

Wouldn't go quite that far. Anyway, you can't take anecdotal evidence like that and make the case that the Wii sells software well. Because it just doesn't. For example, it would be stupid if I were to tell you that the Xbox 360 is a great software mover because Gears 2 has sold 2 million so far -- because there's far more than one game out there.

The point is that besides Wii Sports (I've never understood why this counts as a game sale anyway, since it comes with the console), the Wii is terrible at moving software. That is partly due to extremely poor third-party support, partly due to Nintendo's own policy of not releasing new entries in their proven franchise until the old ones stop selling, and partly due to poor corporate policy (e.g. not telling major 3rd-party developers about the WiiMotionPlus until they found out at E3).

You can cite any anecdotal, personal evidence you like, but the reality is that the Wii's attach rate is in the toilet. It has 5.5 games/console (remember that this, for some reason, includes Wii Sports, so is really 4.5), whereas the 360 has 8.1 (Source (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/ps3-has-lowest-console-attach-rate)). The PS3 is, admittedly, slightly behind the Wii. But you can't say that Nintendo's machine is great at selling games. It just isn't.

My point is that Nintendo 1st party still sells incredibly well. Like I said before, the poor attach rate isn't due to the fact that Nintendo isn't putting out quality titles that don't sell. Their 1st party offerings have sold fine. Also, Wii sports is included in the attach rate because in Asian countries like Japan, Wii sports isn't bundled with the system. I think we both agree that the wii attach rate is poor but the culprit has less to do with this varied audience and Nintendo neglect but rather the 3rd party developers' refusal to put quality titles on the wii. If a game like Dragon Quest X or Monster Hunter 3 fails to make a dent in software sales, then the point can be made that wii owners don't buy real games. Until then, it's just a cheap excuse for 3rd party developers to not put forth any type of effort on the wii.

Lol...check out Zero Punctuation's review of Wii Force Unleashed. (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/251-Star-Wars-The-Force-Unleashed) "The slight graphical downgrade [on the Wii] became 'it looks like it was left in a swamp monster's pocket during laundry day'". Dunno -- played it on the 360 and I've seen it on the Wii and it...wow...looks awful.

Well, like I said in my post, I had already played it first on the real system and wasn't exactly playing it on the Wii for the graphics.




You can cite any anecdotal, personal evidence you like, but the reality is that the Wii's attach rate is in the toilet. It has 5.5 games/console (remember that this, for some reason, includes Wii Sports, so is really 4.5), whereas the 360 has 8.1 (Source (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/ps3-has-lowest-console-attach-rate)). The PS3 is, admittedly, slightly behind the Wii. But you can't say that Nintendo's machine is great at selling games. It just isn't.

LOL, your source article states that when you throw out the first year (when the PS3 & Wii weren't on the market and the 360 had no competition) that 360 attach rate falls to 6.5...so basically one game per console ahead of the PS3 & Wii. Hmmm....

I love that people hate the Wii...the hate is just an uneasiness that their "Favorite system" is being threatened by such a simple machine...LOL

I have no desire to buy the PS3 or X Box. Kids...the whole family...loves the Wii...

The Wii is interactive...and interactive means fun...the Wii is used at parties and for drinking games. Serious gamers can have your serious games..the Wii is about fun and people interaction.
Most people do not want to sit in a dark room for hours upon hours playing a pointless game...
We would rather play/have fun for an hour or two and move on..the game will be there the next day...or next week...whenever we get the urge to play...

Of course the Wii is making significant strides against the HD consoles. Nintendo tells us when we NEED hd gaming. I anxiously await the release of the Wii HD! I'm sure I'll be able to make a nice profit off of those on CL/ebay!

But I am boggled by how third party multiplatform games perform on the Wii compared to the other systems. If the Wii gets a decent version, such as the last COD game, why does it still get slaughtered by sales of the same game on the 360 and Ps3? I can kind of see how it does with the 360 version since the 360 has a pretty good installed base and that type of game is right up their alley, but letting the PS3 version sell more copies is unacceptable. The PS3 has a very small fraction of consoles in US homes compared to the Wii, yet more people buy the Ps3 version?! I don't get it.

Of course the Wii is making significant strides against the HD consoles. Nintendo tells us when we NEED hd gaming. I anxiously await the release of the Wii HD! I'm sure I'll be able to make a nice profit off of those on CL/ebay!

But I am boggled by how third party multiplatform games perform on the Wii compared to the other systems. If the Wii gets a decent version, such as the last COD game, why does it still get slaughtered by sales of the same game on the 360 and Ps3? I can kind of see how it does with the 360 version since the 360 has a pretty good installed base and that type of game is right up their alley, but letting the PS3 version sell more copies is unacceptable. The PS3 has a very small fraction of consoles in US homes compared to the Wii, yet more people buy the Ps3 version?! I don't get it.

You don't get it because the you fail to understand that the Wii player is not a COD player... Wii players are not gamers...they are casual players who occasion want to have interactive fun...nothing to get at all...The Wii player and the "Gamer" are two totally different demographics and people...

You don't get it because the you fail to understand that the Wii player is not a COD player... Wii players are not gamers...they are casual players who occasion want to have interactive fun...nothing to get at all...The Wii player and the "Gamer" are two totally different demographics and people...

That's about right. The vast majority of Wii owners are not gamers at all. You can tell this by the comments often made by Wii owners... something like "I have no desire to sit in a dark room by myself and play with some 13 year old kid blah blah blah..." Its the general non-gamer justification for enjoying boring, crappy Wii games. Manufacturing fun out of a game that just isn't. :lol: You can play PS3 and 360 games with your friends just as well as with the Wii and actually play good games. :bulb:

I don't think the Wii is threatening the PS3 or 360 in the long run... I think as more people are introduced to gaming, more people will want to play better games and will end up buying one of the others.

That's about right. The vast majority of Wii owners are not gamers at all. You can tell this by the comments often made by Wii owners... something like "I have no desire to sit in a dark room by myself and play with some 13 year old kid blah blah blah..." Its the general non-gamer justification for enjoying boring, crappy Wii games. Manufacturing fun out of a game that just isn't. :lol: You can play PS3 and 360 games with your friends just as well as with the Wii and actually play good games. :bulb:

I don't think the Wii is threatening the PS3 or 360 in the long run... I think as more people are introduced to gaming, more people will want to play better games and will end up buying one of the others.


New Wii Slogan:

"The Wii- Manufacturing fun out of games that aren't since 2006" :lmao:

Last part of your post is a good point...MS is obviously going after the casual market hardcore now w/ the $200 pricepoint and all of their ads recently have been touting the "200+ family games."

You don't get it because the you fail to understand that the Wii player is not a COD player... Wii players are not gamers...they are casual players who occasion want to have interactive fun...nothing to get at all...The Wii player and the "Gamer" are two totally different demographics and people...

WRONG! I am a gamer. I play games on the Wii. I know many people just like me. What are games, if not "interactive fun?" How are games on the PS3 or 360 different? Do they not include "interactive fun?" Does using a standard controller not constitute as "interactive"? Playing games with better graphics is not "fun?" I'm sorry, but I'm just VERY confused. You throw this term "interactive fun" around without backing it up, and that just cannot stand!

Please do tell, what is your definition of "interactive fun," and what do you consider PS3/360 games if not "interactive fun"

This should be good...

That's about right. The vast majority of Wii owners are not gamers at all. You can tell this by the comments often made by Wii owners... something like "I have no desire to sit in a dark room by myself and play with some 13 year old kid blah blah blah..." Its the general non-gamer justification for enjoying boring, crappy Wii games. Manufacturing fun out of a game that just isn't. :lol: You can play PS3 and 360 games with your friends just as well as with the Wii and actually play good games. :bulb:

I don't think the Wii is threatening the PS3 or 360 in the long run... I think as more people are introduced to gaming, more people will want to play better games and will end up buying one of the others.

You really cannot make blanket statements like that without backing it up. Just because your old grandmother owns a Wii, does NOT mean that the vast majority of Wii owners are like your old decrepit grandmother. I can just as easily use anecdotal evidence and say a lot of my HARDCORE gamer friends have a Wii and they like it. Does that mean the vast majority of Wii owners are like my hardcore gamer friends? Not necessarily. Unless a scientific poll is done, you cannot pigeonhole Wii owners.

And then you say Wii games are "boring" and crappy." If you're going to take a sample of games such as Emergency Mayhem, Alien Syndrome, and Ninja Reflex then your point could stand. But I could say Xbox 360 and PS3 games are boring and crappy and justify that statement with games such as Golden Axe, Lair, and Haze.

And believe me, the Wii IS threatening the PS3 and 360, especially the PS3. Developing for the PS3 just doesn't make a lot of sense with such a small owner base. More and more developers are going to start making Wii games instead of 360/PS3 games. That is going to hurt the 360 and PS3 in the long run. As more and more developers opt to develop for the Wii, people will see that the Wii is getting much more support than the other consoles and they will buy the Wii. That hurts both the 360 and the PS3!

New Wii Slogan:

"The Wii- Manufacturing fun out of games that aren't since 2006" :lmao:

Last part of your post is a good point...MS is obviously going after the casual market hardcore now w/ the $200 pricepoint and all of their ads recently have been touting the "200+ family games."

But the thing is their new marketing campaign is not working. That is evidenced by the Wii hardware numbers that CRUSHED the 360 and PS3 in November.

You really cannot make blanket statements like that without backing it up. Just because your old grandmother owns a Wii... (Charlie Brown voice) Wah, wah wah wah, wah.
:sleepy:


And then you say Wii games are "boring" and crappy." If you're going to take a sample of games such as Emergency Mayhem, Alien Syndrome, and Ninja Reflex then your point could stand. But I could say Xbox 360 and PS3 games are boring and crappy and justify that statement with games such as Golden Axe, Lair, and Haze.

No, you can look at metacritic if you want (or other review sites). There are a ton of crappy Wii games in comparison and less good ones than either PS3 or 360.


And believe me, the Wii IS threatening the PS3 and 360, especially the PS3. Developing for the PS3 just doesn't make a lot of sense with such a small owner base. More and more developers are going to start making Wii games instead of 360/PS3 games. That is going to hurt the 360 and PS3 in the long run. As more and more developers opt to develop for the Wii, people will see that the Wii is getting much more support than the other consoles and they will buy the Wii. That hurts both the 360 and the PS3!

Wii games still don't sell well so I don't see your point? Sure they sell a ton of consoles, but until they start selling a lot of games, there's not a huge threat of devs not making games for the others. Maybe it doesn't make sense to you, but that's no surprise. ;)

I own a Wii and a 360. Don't have a PS3 for reasons best left for another thread.

Let me say straight out that "hardcore gamers" will never be satisfied with a Wii. However, adults like myself find it rather entertaining. Those of us with girlfriends/wives/families can find ways to play with our families as opposed to always just playing with ourselves.

As fun as it is to play GoW2 or CoD:WaW or whatever against some 15Yo in Estovakia who thinks he's l33t because he's yet to have a job, it doesn't mean it isn't also fun to step onto the Wii fit and snowboard against the girlfriend.

The whole "which system is better" argument is just a joke. They are different systems for different markets. Sure there is a TON of shovelware on the Wii but I don't buy it. I buy games that are fun and that the girlfriend wants to play (because the more she likes the Wii, the more understanding she is of games in general and thus about my 360). However there is a ton of crap on the 360 and PS3 as well. Do I really need 14,082 FPS'? Heck no. Does that mean that my 360 blows because it's too FPS oriented? No, because I played the hell out of the Lego games and Saints Row and GTA and so forth. Different boats and all that.

If you don't like the Wii then go back to playing GoW2 against aforementioned Estovakian l33t kids. Likewise if you don't like the 360/PS3 then step onto the Wii Fit (don't jump on it) and Yoga or bowl your heart out. Just enjoy what you enjoy and grow up enough to let others enjoy what they want. That's call a free market.

/rant.
:iagree: A lot of analyst and "hardcore" gamer seem to have hard time grasping that. It almost seem they are trying to bury casual game market or deny of it's existence.


If Xbox 360/PS3 are without Halo, Call of Duty, Gears of War, Grand Theft Auto, and Metal Gear Solid, would they be as popular as today?

If Wii is without Zelda: Twilight Princess, Mario Galaxy,Mario Kart, Smash Bros Brawl, WiiFit, Wii Sports, would it sell as popular as today?

Now out of the 2 category of games, pick which one would most casual gamers play? Remember casual gamers may get motion sickness very easily, do not want to see a lot of sex/violence, or not able or the time to grasp complicate/complex/steep learning curve games. These are the people who enjoy playing pac-man, bejeweled, solitaire, frogger, or tetris.

I think Little Big Planet is a right step of expanding their market to casual gamers....hopefully Microsoft will come out with their own.

Is this thread about how MS and Sony need to start catering to the casual market to get their console sales up? Because I must have misunderstood the topic...

That's about right. The vast majority of Wii owners are not gamers at all. You can tell this by the comments often made by Wii owners... something like "I have no desire to sit in a dark room by myself and play with some 13 year old kid blah blah blah..." Its the general non-gamer justification for enjoying boring, crappy Wii games. Manufacturing fun out of a game that just isn't. :lol: You can play PS3 and 360 games with your friends just as well as with the Wii and actually play good games. :bulb:

I don't think the Wii is threatening the PS3 or 360 in the long run... I think as more people are introduced to gaming, more people will want to play better games and will end up buying one of the others.
I thought people who played Wii weren't real gamers. Your prediction contradicts itself :)

I thought people who played Wii weren't real gamers. Your prediction contradicts itself :)

Oh SNAP!! Well, I think there are lots of Wii owners who aren't gamers, but it only helps the industry because of the "non-geekification" (my own word :D) of gaming. I bet there will be people introduced to gaming through the Wii who will get curious enough to buy the others. Maybe I'm wrong... :dontknow:

:iagree: A lot of analyst and "hardcore" gamer seem to have hard time grasping that. It almost seem they are trying to bury casual game market or deny of it's existence.


If Xbox 360/PS3 are without Halo, Call of Duty, Gears of War, Grand Theft Auto, and Metal Gear Solid, would they be as popular as today?

If Wii is without Zelda: Twilight Princess, Mario Galaxy,Mario Kart, Smash Bros Brawl, WiiFit, Wii Sports, would it sell as popular as today?

Now out of the 2 category of games, pick which one would most casual gamers play? Remember casual gamers may get motion sickness very easily, do not want to see a lot of sex/violence, or not able or the time to grasp complicate/complex/steep learning curve games. These are the people who enjoy playing pac-man, bejeweled, solitaire, frogger, or tetris.

I think Little Big Planet is a right step of expanding their market to casual gamers....hopefully Microsoft will come out with their own.
whoa, is this a comparison about how if sony/MS didn't have 3rd party support, they'd be nowhere? Cause that Wii list is all 1st party

Just throwing that out there

whoa, is this a comparison about how if sony/MS didn't have 3rd party support, they'd be nowhere? Cause that Wii list is all 1st party

Just throwing that out there
Wii has a few good 3rd parties. Zack and Wiki, RE4 (remake), okami (remake), deBlob, Tiger09, no more heroes, boom blox, etc with more to come next year (Conduit, MadWorld, HotD Overkill, Deadly Creatures, Tenchu, Little King's Story ...).

But I always find the complaining about first party games funny. It's like complaining that Ferrari only makes sports cars.

:sleepy:


No, you can look at metacritic if you want (or other review sites). There are a ton of crappy Wii games in comparison and less good ones than either PS3 or 360.


Wii games still don't sell well so I don't see your point? Sure they sell a ton of consoles, but until they start selling a lot of games, there's not a huge threat of devs not making games for the others. Maybe it doesn't make sense to you, but that's no surprise. ;)


I did look on metacritic and there appears to be a larger percentage of crappy games on the 360 and PS3! Wow! Looks like the Wii has better games! w00t. Point PROVEN!

Some multiplatform games sell better on the Wii than the other consoles, some don't. Publishers just need to find out what type of games will be successful on the Wii, and that's when you'll see development of PS3/360 games by third party developers drop off.

w00t. Point PROVEN!


Don't think so. Actually not at all. :shake:

oh, definitely so.

oh, definitely so.

http://blog.wired.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/03/04/shovelware_2.jpg

But the thing is their new marketing campaign is not working. That is evidenced by the Wii hardware numbers that CRUSHED the 360 and PS3 in November.

Uh...ooh...yeah -- Look at you go! Air out that epeen! That's right, air it out!

Man, you just keep digging yourself deeper and deeper. Kratos was just pointing out that most of the (admittedly few) people who insist on coming to the defense of their Ninten-god (bwoooop, let's go NintendoDefenseForce (joke (http://www.sonydefenseforce.com/))) hilariously stereotype people who play games as some kind of weird nerd-people. I always LOL at those who say that gamers are embracing "last-gen" or something when they like controllers -- that's like Sony defending the SixAxis because it had that lawsuit going on. You guys are just embarrassing yourselves. BloomBlox? Seriously? I mean, yeah it's an OK game, but if that's the best the Wii has to offer, then that's pretty funny.

The Wii has embraced crappy hardware, a well-intentioned but crappily-implemented control scheme, has very little third-party support, and relies on ignorance and hardware volume to stay afloat. Do I feel threatened by it? No, not really. At least one of the Big Two will release a 'real' gaming console next-next-gen. I just think it's funny that you two guys always jump to its defense on these boards. Have fun.

http://blog.wired.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/03/04/shovelware_2.jpg
:lol:

But don't forget what platform Bomberman Zero is on.... ;) Shovelware indicates popularity, nothing more.

That said, I'm secretly hoping that there's a ninjabread man 2 -- but handled by a developer who actually graduated HS.

Uh...ooh...yeah -- Look at you go! Air out that epeen! That's right, air it out!

Man, you just keep digging yourself deeper and deeper. Kratos was just pointing out that most of the (admittedly few) people who insist on coming to the defense of their Ninten-god (bwoooop, let's go NintendoDefenseForce (joke (http://www.sonydefenseforce.com/))) hilariously stereotype people who play games as some kind of weird nerd-people. I always LOL at those who say that gamers are embracing "last-gen" or something when they like controllers -- that's like Sony defending the SixAxis because it had that lawsuit going on. You guys are just embarrassing yourselves. BloomBlox? Seriously? I mean, yeah it's an OK game, but if that's the best the Wii has to offer, then that's pretty funny.

The Wii has embraced crappy hardware, a well-intentioned but crappily-implemented control scheme, has very little third-party support, and relies on ignorance and hardware volume to stay afloat. Do I feel threatened by it? No, not really. At least one of the Big Two will release a 'real' gaming console next-next-gen. I just think it's funny that you two guys always jump to its defense on these boards. Have fun.
The "Big Two?" :lmao: Someone doesn't take market-place reversal well....

Uh...ooh...yeah -- Look at you go! Air out that epeen! That's right, air it out!

Man, you just keep digging yourself deeper and deeper. Kratos was just pointing out that most of the (admittedly few) people who insist on coming to the defense of their Ninten-god (bwoooop, let's go NintendoDefenseForce (joke (http://www.sonydefenseforce.com/))) hilariously stereotype people who play games as some kind of weird nerd-people. I always LOL at those who say that gamers are embracing "last-gen" or something when they like controllers -- that's like Sony defending the SixAxis because it had that lawsuit going on. You guys are just embarrassing yourselves. BloomBlox? Seriously? I mean, yeah it's an OK game, but if that's the best the Wii has to offer, then that's pretty funny.

The Wii has embraced crappy hardware, a well-intentioned but crappily-implemented control scheme, has very little third-party support, and relies on ignorance and hardware volume to stay afloat. Do I feel threatened by it? No, not really. At least one of the Big Two will release a 'real' gaming console next-next-gen. I just think it's funny that you two guys always jump to its defense on these boards. Have fun.


BloomBlox is the best the Wii has to offer? LOL, you know nothing! Oh wait, you're the guy that didn't know the Wii remote uses bluetooth technology! Your statement makes perfect sense now. You're just ignorant! LOL!!

Hahah, that is too funny, you looking 5-6 years into the future for Microsoft or Sony to make a comeback. What could either do differently to attract new customers? Nothing! Sony might be able to win back some customers who sold off their PS2's and bought a Wii, but Microsoft has already made their niche. Now that's funny. Nintendo's consoles for the past couple of gens have been niche consoles. Now Microsoft's and Sony's consoles are the niche consoles! Hilarious! LOL

BloomBlox is the best the Wii has to offer?

Oh wait, you're the guy that didn't know the Wii remote uses bluetooth technology!

I was responding to Bonk, who was saying that BoomBlox was an example of a great 3rd-party game for the Wii. Obviously it's not the best game on the platform, nor was I saying that.

As far as the Bluetooth thing -- this is another example of your delusions, my friend. The Wiimote may be Bluetooth, but stop and think for a second: why do we need that sensor bar. Duuh...that's how it detects motion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_Remote#Sensing). Still need that infrared bar, and it still sucks (http://slate.com/id/2154157).

But go ahead and keep insulting me. It's kind of fun (not to mention funny) actually.

whoa, is this a comparison about how if sony/MS didn't have 3rd party support, they'd be nowhere? Cause that Wii list is all 1st party

Just throwing that out there
I am not making comparison between 1st party or 3rd party. I am making comparison between games that casual market would like to play.

When I hear Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo PAY for exclusive to me that's no different than 1st party. All they are doing is temporary rent out 3rd party as a 1st party.

I was responding to Bonk, who was saying that BoomBlox was an example of a great 3rd-party game for the Wii. Obviously it's not the best game on the platform, nor was I saying that.

No, your words were actually "if that's the best wii has to offer...." when responding to me. I never said that it was the best wii had to offer, but I did say that it was a good third party game (which it is). You changed the frame of the argument. D&P's actually right on this one. Give him a cookie.


As far as the Bluetooth thing -- this is another example of your delusions, my friend. The Wiimote may be Bluetooth, but stop and think for a second: why do we need that sensor bar. Duuh...that's how it detects motion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_Remote#Sensing). Still need that infrared bar, and it still sucks (http://slate.com/id/2154157).


You really have no idea of what you're talking about, do you? The sensor bar DOES ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR DETECTING MOTION. You know how I know this? Because mine is broken. Do you know how I use my Wii? I point the remote at the overhead fixture in my room. The "sensor bar" is nothing more than two LEDs producing IR which the remote senses and triangulates from. The only way it "sucks" is that the lights are not powerful enough or far enough apart for how you play (maybe you have a projector and play from across the room). In which case, you can build your own for <$20. All parts can be bought at RadioShack.

I can't remember the exact context of the bluetooth conversation any more, but I'm positive that you claimed the Wiimote isn't bluetooth. You're simply wrong about that, give it up. As for being "completely bluetooth...", while that technically is possible (I believe), it would be in no way better while being much more expensive. Not to mention, you'd need to use another frequency to communicate back and forth to the console. No reason to replace the IR "lights" with bluetooth emitters solely for triangulation.

Uh...ooh...yeah -- Look at you go! Air out that epeen! That's right, air it out!

Man, you just keep digging yourself deeper and deeper. Kratos was just pointing out that most of the (admittedly few) people who insist on coming to the defense of their Ninten-god (bwoooop, let's go NintendoDefenseForce (joke (http://www.sonydefenseforce.com/))) hilariously stereotype people who play games as some kind of weird nerd-people. I always LOL at those who say that gamers are embracing "last-gen" or something when they like controllers -- that's like Sony defending the SixAxis because it had that lawsuit going on. You guys are just embarrassing yourselves. BloomBlox? Seriously? I mean, yeah it's an OK game, but if that's the best the Wii has to offer, then that's pretty funny.

The Wii has embraced crappy hardware, a well-intentioned but crappily-implemented control scheme, has very little third-party support, and relies on ignorance and hardware volume to stay afloat. Do I feel threatened by it? No, not really. At least one of the Big Two will release a 'real' gaming console next-next-gen. I just think it's funny that you two guys always jump to its defense on these boards. Have fun.
Wii had some how personally threatening you? :confused:

Unless I'm reading things wrong, this makes it look like Kratos claim that the wii sells less games overall isn't correct:

http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly.php

Unless I'm reading things wrong, this makes it look like Kratos claim that the wii sells less games overall isn't correct:

http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly.php
he's talking about attach rate, or # games sold / # consoles sold. Which was slighty less than 360 at last report (with length of system on market taken into account), though it's been increasing from what I hear.

You would expect more games to be sold for a platform that has more consoles on the market.

he's talking about attach rate, or # games sold / # consoles sold. Which was slighty less than 360 at last report (with length of system on market taken into account), though it's been increasing from what I hear.

And especially 3rd party, which is what the thread is about... Its not like any of the 3 are going to fall off the map in the near future anyway so I don't worry too much about this stuff. D&P is just a ridiculous troll who tries to provoke people into arguing.

And especially 3rd party, which is what the thread is about... Its not like any of the 3 are going to fall off the map in the near future anyway so I don't worry too much about this stuff. D&P is just a ridiculous troll who tries to provoke people into arguing.
he's not alone. He just does it in the "other direction" ;)

No, your words were actually "if that's the best wii has to offer...." when responding to me. I never said that it was the best wii had to offer, but I did say that it was a good third party game (which it is). You changed the frame of the argument. D&P's actually right on this one. Give him a cookie.
It's a lost cause. They are not into casual games so even if it's a great game or best game it's not going to change.

It's like comparing Pac-Man to Call of Duty. Casual gamer will think pac-man is the greatest and brush away call of duty.

You really have no idea of what you're talking about, do you? The sensor bar DOES ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR DETECTING MOTION. You know how I know this? Because mine is broken. Do you know how I use my Wii? I point the remote at the overhead fixture in my room. The "sensor bar" is nothing more than two LEDs producing IR which the remote senses and triangulates from. The only way it "sucks" is that the lights are not powerful enough or far enough apart for how you play (maybe you have a projector and play from across the room). In which case, you can build your own for <$20. All parts can be bought at RadioShack.
The wiki article clearly explain how it works.

If he is referring to IR sending info like a TV remote then clearly he didn't read the article. If he is referring to IR technology suck then it's a lost cause. I am sure there are other ways to detect motion but can it done affordability? Most if not all motion senor technology have a patent tie to them. Would you like to buy a Wii for $600 with better motion sensor?

he's not alone. He just does it in the "other direction" ;)

I don't know if you're referring to me or someone else, but he's one of the worst (or at least one of the most obnoxious) IMO.

It's a lost cause. They are not into casual games so even if it's a great game or best game it's not going to change.

It's like comparing Pac-Man to Call of Duty. Casual gamer will think pac-man is the greatest and brush away call of duty.

[QUOTE=bonkman;15590928]You really have no idea of what you're talking about, do you? The sensor bar DOES ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR DETECTING MOTION. You know how I know this? Because mine is broken. Do you know how I use my Wii? I point the remote at the overhead fixture in my room. The "sensor bar" is nothing more than two LEDs producing IR which the remote senses and triangulates from. The only way it "sucks" is that the lights are not powerful enough or far enough apart for how you play (maybe you have a projector and play from across the room). In which case, you can build your own for
Him linking to it doesn't mean he read it ;) The sensor bar is not "how it detects motion." Motion is detected (partially) by using change in position relative to the IR source sensed by the remote. The rest is done by the accelerometers. The sensor merely provides the IR.

I don't know if you're referring to me or someone else, but he's one of the worst (or at least one of the most obnoxious) IMO.
not you, don't worry :cheers:

Him linking to it doesn't mean he read it ;) The sensor bar is not "how it detects motion." Motion is detected (partially) by using change in position relative to the IR source sensed by the remote. The rest is done by the accelerometers. The sensor merely provides the IR.
It's pretty bad if he didn't because the article even metion one of the reason why Sensor bar exist
Unlike a light gun that senses light from a television screen, the Wii Remote senses light from the console's Sensor Bar (model number RVL-014), which allows consistent usage regardless of a television's type or size.

I am sure Nintendo could have build the bar into the system but people don't always have their system in front of the tv.

By the way how did the bluetooth and motion sensor get even started? They got nothing to do with each other. One is a wireless communication format and the other is technology on detecting motion.

I am not even sure why DogAndPony mentioned Bluetooth. However he didn't put it in the context of motion sensing either. :confused:

By the way how did the bluetooth and motion sensor get even started? They got nothing to do with each other. One is a wireless communication format and the other is technology on detecting motion.

I am not even sure why DogAndPony mentioned Bluetooth. However he didn't put it in the context of motion sensing either. :confused:
Found the post! (http://forums.slickdeals.net/showpost.php?p=15453221&postcount=5)

In the "what is a wii" thread.

Found the post! (http://forums.slickdeals.net/showpost.php?p=15453221&postcount=5)

In the "what is a wii" thread.

:lmao: Well if that is the case then he definitely didn't read the article.
Manufacturer Nintendo
Type Video game controller
Generation Seventh generation era
Retail availability November 19, 2006
Storage capacity 16 KiB EEPROM chip (16.3 kilobytes)
Connectivity Bluetooth

The controller communicates wirelessly with the console via short-range Bluetooth radio

Or know the difference between motion sensing and bluetooth.

No, your words were actually "if that's the best wii has to offer...." when responding to me. I never said that it was the best wii had to offer, but I did say that it was a good third party game (which it is). You changed the frame of the argument. D&P's actually right on this one. Give him a cookie.
Speaking of Boom Blox. The first game ars technica mention in "The five happiest gaming surprises of 2008":

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081222-the-five-happiest-gaming-surprises-of-2008.html
The five happiest gaming surprises of 2008

Last week we looked back at 2008 to see what games and releases disappointed us the most during the year. It was an agonizing list, and it made us remember all the high hopes we had for all the games that let us down.

Leaving on a down note isn't our style though, so today we'll share some of the games and ideas that surprised us in a positive way this year. Let's leave the majority of the blockbusters aside, and dig into the happy surprises of the year.

Boom Blox

Speaking of Boom Blox. The first game ars technica mention in "The five happiest gaming surprises of 2008":

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081222-the-five-happiest-gaming-surprises-of-2008.html
tsk tsk. Real gamers know that games aren't supposed to be "happy." They're supposed to be manly and filled with guns and blood.

I don't know if you're referring to me or someone else, but he's one of the worst (or at least one of the most obnoxious) IMO.
definitely talkin about me

tsk tsk. Real gamers know that games aren't supposed to be "happy." They're supposed to be manly and filled with guns and blood.

You know that's not true Bonk, but a lot of people do indeed like the M games. And I think I heard the Wii is supposed to get a few pretty soon.

not you, don't worry :cheers:

I think he means me. Not entirely sure though. Funny that you resort to calling me a "troll who provokes argument" -- don't believe I've ever insulted you. Ah well, you can stoop as low as you please.

I was responding to Bonk, who was saying that BoomBlox was an example of a great 3rd-party game for the Wii. Obviously it's not the best game on the platform, nor was I saying that.

As far as the Bluetooth thing -- this is another example of your delusions, my friend. The Wiimote may be Bluetooth, but stop and think for a second: why do we need that sensor bar. Duuh...that's how it detects motion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_Remote#Sensing). Still need that infrared bar, and it still sucks (http://slate.com/id/2154157).

But go ahead and keep insulting me. It's kind of fun (not to mention funny) actually.

I was just pointing out that you're ignorant because you didn't know the wii remote was bluetooth. I wasn't saying anything about the quality of the motion controls (although I think they are FANTASTIC!)

he's talking about attach rate, or # games sold / # consoles sold. Which was slighty less than 360 at last report (with length of system on market taken into account), though it's been increasing from what I hear.

You would expect more games to be sold for a platform that has more consoles on the market.

How do they calculate attach ratios? Do the Wii and the game(s) have to be purchased at the same time on the same receipt? If so, all the Wiis that resellers have bought up has definitely skewed the results. Resellers (like myself) buy up 20-30 Wii's at a time to flip them on CL or ebay. Of course that is going to push the attach ratio down! Then you look at the 360 and PS3 where resellers can't make a dime, so you're only having people who actually want the console buying it. And unlike the Wii, neither the PS3 nor the 360 come with any games. So it makes sense that the attach ratio would be a bit higher.

I don't know if you're referring to me or someone else, but he's one of the worst (or at least one of the most obnoxious) IMO.

obnoxious because I don't agree with you? LOL!

How do they calculate attach ratios? Do the Wii and the game(s) have to be purchased at the same time on the same receipt?

No -- it's just the ratio of (total games sold) to (total consoles sold).

Oh, ok. Even still though, shouldn't the attach ratio be 1:1 since every Wii comes with a game?

How do they calculate attach ratios? Do the Wii and the game(s) have to be purchased at the same time on the same receipt? If so, all the Wiis that resellers have bought up has definitely skewed the results. Resellers (like myself) buy up 20-30 Wii's at a time to flip them on CL or ebay. Of course that is going to push the attach ratio down! Then you look at the 360 and PS3 where resellers can't make a dime, so you're only having people who actually want the console buying it. And unlike the Wii, neither the PS3 nor the 360 come with any games. So it makes sense that the attach ratio would be a bit higher.





This might be your worst post yet....and this wasn't even a troll post. You were actually be serious here. I can't believe you typed that paragraph and actually hit the submit button. Jesus..H...Christ.

EDIT:
To be fair, it's not right to call this your worst post and not to at least take the time to point out what sucks about it. So, here we go:

1. You ask how they calculate attach rate, but in the post you quoted from Bonk he clearly states what components go into the calculation, lol.
2. "Do the Wii and the game(s) have to be purchased at the same time on the same receipt?" Seriously?! If that were the case, how would any games bought after you initially purchase the system be counted towards the attachment rate???
3."And unlike the Wii, neither the PS3 nor the 360 come with any games" Actually, both the PS3 and the 360 have bundles that include game(s) which really should be common knowledge to anyone who posts in this forum or anyone who has ever set foot in a retail store that has a video game section for that matter.

obnoxious because I don't agree with you? LOL!

Nope. There are and have been plenty of people that didn't agree with me on different topics and I never called them obnoxious trolls. I call you that because of the ridiculously idiotic things you post with CAPS and exclamation points!!! LOL! w00t!!! Point PROVEN!!!!!!

This is HUGE!!!!

This might be your worst post yet....and this wasn't even a troll post. You were actually be serious here. I can't believe you typed that paragraph and actually hit the submit button. Jesus..H...Christ.

One of his completely serious posts and it didn't make him look any smarter. :lol: look at the 1:1 post... he's still confused. :lol:

This might be your worst post yet....and this wasn't even a troll post. You were actually be serious here. I can't believe you typed that paragraph and actually hit the submit button. Jesus..H...Christ.

Overall, I think it was a pretty good post. No, scratch that. An excellent post! I've done much better, but this is definitely a quality post. Thanks!

Overall, I think it was a pretty good post. No, scratch that. An excellent post! I've done much better, but this is definitely a quality post. Thanks!

Fight! Fight! Fight! :lol: :bounce:

Overall, I think it was a pretty good post. No, scratch that. An excellent post! I've done much better, but this is definitely a quality post. Thanks!

No, actually, it was an epic fail. I went back and editted my previous post if you want to know where you went wrong. I'm sure it won't help, but at least I know I tried.

No, actually, it was an epic fail. I went back and editted my previous post if you want to know where you went wrong. I'm sure it won't help, but at least I know I tried.

You need to edit your last post! OR should I say editt!!

You need to edit your last post! OR should I say editt!!

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL -- Vette, he's got you on semantics dude. DogAndPony, please quit while you're...reasonably far behind.

You need to edit your last post! OR should I say editt!!

I hope for your sake that you're no older than like 13.

I'm older than 13 ;)