REITs ? Anyone invested in them.
 

Particularly I am considering putting money in Cole REIT iV.
Anyone else here have experience with REITs.
If anyone has got CCPT ii or CCPT iii , I was wondering how much is the dividend they are getting.

TIA.

I invest in the Vanguard REIT.

Small positions in mortgage reit ARR - 16.37% Yield, pays monthly and NLY - 12.88% Yield

vnq...no transaction fee w/ TD

both of these should be considered as m-REIT instead.

Much higher return but riskier

Bump.

Many of these REIT vehicles are getting their ass kicked lately due to several reasons. ARR and AGNC tripped my level indicators I set months ago. If you're a gambler and want to try to catch a falling knife, watch the long tails on the daily and weekly candles for an indication how quickly these things are dumped and bought right back.

Out of the companies I've started following, O (Realty Income Corp) looks the strongest. Watch earnings next week on this one as it's gotten a little bubbly on a monthly basis. Doesn't mean it cannot rip to new highs, however.

Keep in mind I follow price action, not dividends as price means everything to me as a speculator.

the mREITs are getting hammered today. I added to NLY. It's been through thick and thin since the late 90s. Even during the housing bubble, it still continued to pay a dividend (although not a great one).

Ugly chart on the reits

I guess:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...1939-300px.jpg

check out life science reits

NLY board was smart.... they have a lot of MBS's on the books that are now worth more, with stock that's worth less so they instituted a buyback under book value of shares. Stock is liking that today :D

I'm a little confused about why buybacks helped the stock price today. Can you (or anyone) explain that to me or point me towards something that does explain why?

From Wikipedia [wikipedia.org],

1. Less stock available to the public, increasing the earnings per share
2. Psychologically, better than raising a dividend then having to drop it later.
3. Companies believes its undervalue, so take advantage of the lower share price
4. Ensures executives meets EPS targets.
5. Makes takeover less possible

So 3/5 are positive for stockholders. 1 is mixed. 1 is negative.

Leveraged REIT if anyone is interested.... 25% payout??? :lmao:

http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/8...eraged-etf

I'll wait for the 3x Leverage :P. I think since its so new, I would give it some time in the market to see how things go first.

It's so dumb. I'll just wait for 8x leveraged REIT ETN's and double my money immediately LOL

Getting there. Anyone getting in here or reloading?

I have a multi-decade horizon so I am chewing off little bits as these mREITs start to die. Their dividends may get cut but I doubt they are going to zero. Even at the worst time since NLY went public (2006), they were still paying a dividend of around 3-4% on the year.

I was wondering your thoughts about to when invest into O. You had mentioned it before and it seems solid

My advice would be to stay away from NLY and AGNC and the other agency REITS. With the Fed committed to buying MBS for the foreseeable future the yields on agency MBS will decline. When the yield declines the Net Interest Margin (difference between the rate they earn and the cost of the repo financing to purchase MBS) compresses and therefore you get selloffs in the stocks and the stocks are at risk of having to cut their dividends.

Id go with AMTG which is about ~35% comprised of non-agency mortgages. These will trade less on where yields go and more on where spreads go. As the world improves, the credit spread vs. nonagency will compress and the prices of nonagency MBS will increase. THis will drive higher prices in the stocks and overall improvement in the book value of the more non-agency focused m-REITS.

With AMTG, you're also taking on the risks of non-agency mortgages however. NLY seems like the safer play, although you are correct in that we are in uncharted waters. NLY has traded in a fairly predictable range for a decade (for the most part), but now the fed is committed to its MBS-buying bazooka

When NLY's dividend collapsed in 2006 (by far the lowest since it went public in the 90s), it will still paying out 3-4% per year. I'll take that, knowing that there will be better days on the horizon

Excellent. Thanks for that. I'd thought of such a scenario but am still thinking some larger specs will buy these up in the endless search for yield regardless of Fed. Seems to me that the initial news of "the Fed's doing ___" is absorbed and the market does what it was going to do all along anyway. Not sure if it's all priced in yet, thus the fishing for feedback on these vehicles.

On it.

Oversold on the daily level and back to some weekly long term trendline support. Still looking for the $35-$36 level and won't take a position until it's found solid support and has given a weekly long signal entry. On the long term picture, I'd like to see a hard and fast move down on high volume to scare the children so it can resume it's uptrend...maybe like $31.

Thanks for the advice.

yes you take on the non-agency risk that isnt backed by Fannie / Freddie like the agency is but agency has rallied so much already and the yields are so low that if rates keep going lower (as they did yesterday) the reits will continue to experience NIM compression and only way to sustain their dividends will be to increase their leverage.

I personally have the view that the housing market is recovering, the economy will continue to recover and spreads will continue to compress, therefore i think non-agency is the better place to be. plus it doesnt have nearly the prepayment risk that agency has.

On the flip side lets say housing is still in trouble and this is just a parting of the storm clouds and the economy continues to stumble, do you still think the spreads will remain and maybe widen? I guess my question is; how much of either scenario is already baked in at this point? Not to mention the fear of the div tax slam coming next year (ie fiscal cliff dive).

I'm running out of popcorn watching some of these REIT instruments thrash back and forth. O is almost to my initial target but still has yet to pick a direction that I'm comfortable with.

A ton of MLPs got slaughtered last week as well, and appeared to be good buys on thurs/fri. APU at 38, MMP at 39, and EPD at 48 were all pretty good deals (for now, it seems). APU was yielding over 8% at that price.

I decided to initiate a small position in O at 37.45. I'll add more if it goes well below that

That's the thing, given the history of these instruments it's not even a slaughter - it's just what they do.

Yeah, I'm not touching any of those pigs. Looks like one more blow off top rally before tiiimmbeerr....

I have a multi decade horizon. Mlps on the whole have been a great asset class to own the several years IMO. I'm adding on huge dips like we saw recently

I seemed to be doing OK so far buying in at low 37 range. It popped through 40 today. Hoping I can add more in the mid 30s at some point.

Nice. It's definitely the strongest performer of the small group I follow. I haven't been paying attn lately, so I missed it.

Staying 90% cash and doing short-medium term trades till the end of the year. I figure when the world ends in three weeks it will be easier for the aliens to manage my account if it's all cash. :eek:

Pulling up to its highest level since early September. Should I be kicking myself for not biting off more on the dip in mid november? I have a feeling the recent news on the ACRT acquisition may be creating bullish headwinds for the shares.

I'd be getting out. Trade the news and lose. Triple top blow off. It's coming down.

I'd take a spec long on AGNC, though.

why that over NLY? why not both?

agency mREITs seem to be getting lots of hate lately

NLY still looks to have some work to do in my book.

Look, it should be very evident at this point that I don't give a rip what the news is on anything in the market. I only pay attention to supply <> price <> demand and the raw data. Price is everything and there's no such thing as "fundamentals" outside of the real-time price. I've simply lost too much money chasing stories told by the boogeyman.

Sentiment, however, is a highly valuable piece of the puzzle and can weigh quite high on speculative positions. I do not ever trade based solely on it, though. Just me.

Closing near $44 now. The ARCT merger went through and the divvy is getting close to a 20% bump

http://www.streetinsider.com/Merg...12128.html

Sweet.

That thing is pointing due north. Crazy. Not getting caught up in that.

Yeah. I think 37.5 was a good starting point. I'd like to add again somewhere in the 30s. I'm definitely nowhere close to doing that now with the VIX near lows and the greed index near highs :D

Almost did 8 days of daily closes outside the upper BB. Seven is the record that I've personally seen. Glad you banked it.

But gravity is a bitch, especially with these instruments. The rest of the pack is just now starting to kind of recover. Make sense? Not to me. Sidelines until further instruction. :nod:

With rates looking like they're about to break up here in the mid-term, what's the speculation on the REIT's? 10-year hit 2% today and looks like it wants to start moving up.

Also, look at NLY, AGNC, ARR and some others compared to MORT. Has MORT gotten ahead or have the others not kept up? There's something I'm missing.

Earnings for a lot of these in the next few weeks. Could be fireworks as always.

Yup. Seems like a net positive to me. Widens the spread, no?

Nice bump in NLY and O today. O at a new high :D

NLY isn't earning enough to cover their dividend, EPS 1.68, current dividend $1.80. I know EPS isn't cash flow, but isn't that a bad sign?

O is simply taking no prisoners. Damn.

Finally got filled on MTGE during the shake n bake today. So I'm in, now y'all can expect a precipitous drop. :eek:

You should also look at CIM - Chimera, sister company of Annaly, same management crew - -$0.09 dvidend per share per quarter, on stock of $3.07 /share. That's a dividend yield of 12.34%. Stock also has the potential to rebound and go back to its earlier levels of $5ish if rates move at all in the next year or two.

Thanks!

As long as you don't mind the risk of investing in a company that buys "non-agency" mortgages. NLY sticks to agency paper (safer, more conservative, backed by the government etc.). Just look at the long-term charts if you don't get what I am saying.

RSO all the way got in low and its at a high now, pays a 20cent dividend quarterly and has been rated amazingly consistently

I know what you are saying. CIM got pounded over the last 2 years as the assets classes were not guaranteed by U.S. Governement. There are a few others that are better, similar to Annaly - - - Take a look at Hatteras (over 12% yield), MFA Financial, Anworth, Redwood Trust. Interesting sector if you do a little legwork / research.

I was looking at REITs and just read this article: http://seekingalpha.com/article/1...de-listing

I don't hold any position on REITs, but was curious about the implications for any holder out there? (I've learning about REITs)

Saw that also - - - - implications are stock price will go down. Should avoid that company, especially those that are looking for stable companies paying dividends. Just my opinion . . . . .

Here's the list of REIT's I'm following. No positions yet.

NLY, O, GOV, HCN, GGP, and SIR.

TWO and O. Things are getting a little silly. Might want to scale out and reinvest when reality resumes. That said, there's nothing holding them down, so buy, buy, buy!?

NLY is trying to climb out of it's rut. One more el-slamo and I'd like to pick some up.

O is a long-term hold for me. I am DRIPping it. I am very happy about my purchase at 37 now :bounce: The dividend increase recently is probably helping things out. I added to NLY in the high 13s to bring my cost-basis down near current market value.... I think with the improving MBS market, it might be turning the corner here. The only thing standing in its way is Helicopter Ben :mad:

MLPs have been on fire lately too ever since the fiscal cliff selloff in late december. 2 of my favorites, EPD and APU, are up nearly 20% since their december lows. EPD is a nice long-term play on the oil/nat gas boom in this country as they own the largest pipeline network around.

Dipping today on secondary offering. It's generally good to sell stock when your share price is high and buy it back when it's low. Good management.

It's just way too hot. Nothing goes straight up like that and can be maintained, secondary offering or not. Looking at the $43 level and then $36 to get back to "normal."

But I 100% agree with you on your comment and using the "DRIP" strategy is great. I'm interested in when you take profits, how much to roll, etc and how many vehicles you're doing this with.

With my long-term DRIPs, I generally just set and forget, but add when the adding is good (I recently added to DIS, YUM, MCD near their lows). In some cases where I think the stock is overvalued significantly (or I just don't need/want any more shares), I take the cash and put it elsewhere (doing that with BP now ---- it's pretty cheap on most metrics but can definitely go back into the 30s quickly).

I get the common stock application, I was asking specifically about REIT vehicles because they don't trade like stocks within the same reinvestment regards. Do you target price or dividend or weight of the overall allocation? Know what I mean?

Honestly hadn't given it that much thought. This is actually my first property REIT. The long-term chart seems pretty much steady growth with an increasing dividend through thick and thin. My plan was to set and forget (and add on big dips).

Dont forget to put your trailing stop or stop orders in for O, dont lose that profit...

A stop-loss order can be a suckers bet. Just ask the people who ended up selling out on O at 37.5 during the mid-november selloff only to watch it immediately start to rebound, culminating into new highs this past month.

It's better to be out of a trade wishing you were in than in a trade wishing you were out.

And far more marriages to trades are made at tops (emotional highs/greed) than at lows. If your plan is set before you pull the trigger and enter, then damage is kept to a very minimum. You will destroy yourself well before the market can. :(

Nothing wrong with using a stop. But just realize that these REITs love to run the stops and recover within the same day (look at all the long tails on the candles on many of them). I personally wouldn't just buy and forget about it, but as long as you've done your homework and know how these things trade, you'll be in good shape.

Cracks starting to form in 0. If $43 fails, I'm drooling at the chance to pick some up sub-$40. A complete washout to $33 or so would be fantastic. That will never happen? It got more than cut in half in 08-09.

NLY still trending nicely.

Yeah I am looking at adding more O as well once this ridiculous market finally corrects....

NLY @ $16 now, above book value. :cool:

And $47 is here. At this rate, Uncle Ben will never let me add to it.

I don't know when to add. It's been a straight line up literally since $37.... all these yield hungry investors are just buying up anything with yield..... blue-chips, MLPs, REITs etc

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoeni...l?page=all


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1...60620.html

AGNC took a nice dump friday. Anyone buying?

I'm trying to decide on AGNC right now. reading this gets me more confused than I had hoped.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/1...oogle_news

Also looking at CWH as it looks like their arbitration bylaw may win over Corvex's concerns. It's down a bit as well and Barrons like CWH.

http://online.barrons.com/article...rticle%3D0

You buying any of the mREITs here? I opened up a position in AGNC around 30. My next add point is below 28.

And speaking O..... $54 today :eek: Bernanke obviously is sticking his head in the sand when it comes to acknowledging yield chasers. The dividend is below 4% and short interest is growing....

What happened to NLY and ARR lately? I have to wonder what they would be doing if the market wasn't so hot as well.

:bounce: O is one of the brighter spots in my portfolio, aside from NFLX's comeback.

All of the mREITs are getting hammered these days, NLY ARR AGNC etc.

Retail REITs dying today. Anyone biting? O hasn't pulled back this much since their last secondary offering

I'm spending some timre reading about mortgage insurers mgt rdn gwn. also fmcc fnma

It wiped out nearly all the gains from this month in the last 2 days :eek:

The conversation spurred off to talk about REITs that are on major exchanges and not OPs question about Cole REIT iV.

I would advise against putting money into a non-listed stock/REIT. You may end up having a difficult time selling the stock, or paying a lot to get it sold, since it's not listed on an exchange.

Who was telling you to get money into Cole REIT iV, a financial adviser?

Here's a good read about non-listed REITS

http://reitwrecks.com/2009/03/non...-list.html