|
|||||||
| View Poll Results: What Is The Best Way To Combat Thumbs-Down Abuse? | |||
| I want both voting transparency and mandatory thumbs-down qualification (options 2 & 3) |
   
|
614 | 26.75% |
| I want a feature enabling me to see everyone who has voted for a specific thread |
  
|
210 | 9.15% |
| I want a feature that requires people to provide a reason for giving thumbs-down |
  
|
997 | 43.44% |
| I want neither voting transparency nor mandatory thumbs-down qualification (options 2 & 3) |
  
|
474 | 20.65% |
| Voters: 2295. You may not vote on this poll | |||
08-17-2007, 12:28 PM
|
#1 | |
NOTE: Just to be clear - My vision of option #3 is that the voter's identity will be revealed along with their reason for voting thumbs-down.Threadcrap and thumbs-down abuse kills a lot of good threads on SD. We can't stop people from threadcrapping, but we need two new features that will effectively combat thumbs-down abuse: 1) Require people who give thumbs-down to give a reason. (option #3) 2) Provide a link in each thread to see everyone who has given thumbs-up and thumbs-down for that thread. (option #2) A lot of people have been asking for these features for a long time, but perhaps the pleas have been too scattered for the powers that be to notice. This poll is an attempt to show the site administrators that there is a lot of demand for these features. There are too many cowards hiding behind their anonymous thumbs-down. There is no good reason to keep the vote private, each thread's full voting record should be made public. If enough people request these features in the proper forum we may finally get them! PLEASE VOTE!!! EDIT 10/16/7 - See post #115 for a potential way to implement a system of TD accountability.
__________________
Last edited by uscpsycho; 10-16-2007 at 08:11 AM.. |
||
| 08-17-2007, 12:28 PM | |
|
|
Wiki Community Board
This can and should be used by you to post updated deal information.
Be sure to read this because it may contain answers to your questions!
This can and should be used by you to post updated deal information.
Be sure to read this because it may contain answers to your questions!
UPDATE: On 9/14 SlickDeals implemented the changes encouraged here in this thread. Thanks to everyone who provided feedback and thanks to SlickDeals for listening to its users and implementing the changes that were desired by a large percentage of users. The implemented changes are fantastic and will be very useful in evaluating deals!
Here's a great example of thumbs down abuse (but now actually become great example of thumbs up/down working as expected) and why controls are (not) needed (there are many examples of this):
The last few pages on the thread above are now talking about cancelling the orders. Looks like the deal wasn't that good to begin with. Actually show thumb up/down working as expected. NO - That's totally coincidental. The motivation behind all the TD was to conceal the thread from others. Nobody in the beginning was giving TD because it was a bad deal. This should have been 5 TU gone to 5 TD but it was 5TD all along because of voting abuse. <--- That's only someone perception. But as we know, people may TD because they think this is price mistake that the store won't honor or the store has poor rating, etc. That doesn't make those people as eBayers that try to hide the thread.
This post can be edited by most users to provide up-to-date information about developments of this thread based on user responses, and user findings. Feel free to add, change or remove information shown here as it becomes available. This includes new coupons, rebates, ideas, thread summary, and similar items.
Following is an biased, one-sided discussion of the topic:
Summary of why the ideas suggested are not good....
From admin/mod: They want to make voting easier so more people will vote instead of harder. And force people to give reason will cause less people to vote so totally opposite of what they want. And Mod/admin will take steps and check out thumb down bandits and take appropriate action so no need for this.
1) If we allow the poster to see who vote the deal down, could potentially lead to retribution - a definite possibility!
Exposing voters will lead to squabbles and resentment among users. Which a lot of time happen to the thread with all kind of personal attack and flaming when someone try to explain why they don't think the deal is good.
It would just invite infinite and lame arguments over whether or not someone's reason was adequate or not.
Which all will lead to more threadcrapping. As we know, threadcrapping kills a lot of good threads.
2) As people mentioned, why people think that making others give a reason for a thumbs down will make the malicious votes stop. People will just say things like price is not good enough or bad product, etc which may or may not be true. you can't force people to provide meaningful reason or prevent people lie about their reason
3) The number of abuse is insignificant. If it is not broken, why change it and possibly make it worse?
As more votes are cast, the tally reflects the consensus.
4) Many people mentioned they would not bother giving thumbs up or down anymore if I had to spend extra time giving a drawn out explaination to why I'm rating it (many normal people will stop voting) . But those abuser will keep voting with comment like "deal is not good". Actually easier for those abuser to vote down a thread since much less people vote.
5) There are just as many people give thumbs up for deals that is not hot. If 'Thumbs down' explanation is mandatory, the same should do with thumbs up. Some people thumbs up just because the effort which has nothing to do with the deal hot or not. Some thumbs up may be because of a funny comment in the post. Some thumbs up because they mentioned something about their school/college. Or some do it because the poster is their friend. Or thumbs up because of cool product (may not be good price), etc.
Some people like to give thumbs up just because it is the best price at the moment. But best price at the moment doesn't mean hot deal. If they thumbs up just because it is best price at the moment, some people don't want to count their thumbs up just as much as those thumbs down abuser.
For example, the average sale price for this item is $90 (normal price $100). They are on sale once every few weeks. The hot deals price every 6 months is like $60. So someone post a deal for that item when one store sell it for $90, it may be lowest price at the moment but definitely not hot deal. I want to know they they thumbs up because they think it is the best price at the moment and not because they know it is the hot deal price (which is as low as $60 for the last 6 months).
If we want best price at the moment, we can use PriceGrabber or similar site.
6) As some people mentioned, people expect too much out of the tu/td system. Take it with a grain of salt and don't get bent out of shape if you don't get the results you want.
7) don't want to people keep bumping up bad deals to explain why they thumb down the deal. If it is bad deal, they should NOT be bump up just to explain why the deal is bad. Especially someone else already mentioned it in the reply.
This post can be edited by most users to provide up-to-date information about developments of this thread based on user responses, and user findings. Feel free to add, change or remove information shown here as it becomes available. This includes new coupons, rebates, ideas, thread summary, and similar items.
Once a Thread Wiki is added to a thread, "Create Wiki" button will disappear. If you would like to learn more about Thread Wiki feature, click here.
This is NOT hot deal forum. This thread is about opinion of this subject. So it is OK to summarize what has been posted and put it here.
If the first post is PROS of the idea, it make total sense to put the summary of CONS of the idea right next to his (on the first page) instead of reading 3-4 pages to find out all the CONS.
Here's a great example of thumbs down abuse (but now actually become great example of thumbs up/down working as expected) and why controls are (not) needed (there are many examples of this):
|
Quote from wikipost I suggest thumbs downing the thread, but repping OP so that fewer Fleabayers will come by. :Direct link to newspage: http://www.konami.com/edealinv/se...l_nbr=3810 |
This post can be edited by most users to provide up-to-date information about developments of this thread based on user responses, and user findings. Feel free to add, change or remove information shown here as it becomes available. This includes new coupons, rebates, ideas, thread summary, and similar items.
Following is an biased, one-sided discussion of the topic:
Summary of why the ideas suggested are not good....
From admin/mod: They want to make voting easier so more people will vote instead of harder. And force people to give reason will cause less people to vote so totally opposite of what they want. And Mod/admin will take steps and check out thumb down bandits and take appropriate action so no need for this.
1) If we allow the poster to see who vote the deal down, could potentially lead to retribution - a definite possibility!
Exposing voters will lead to squabbles and resentment among users. Which a lot of time happen to the thread with all kind of personal attack and flaming when someone try to explain why they don't think the deal is good.
It would just invite infinite and lame arguments over whether or not someone's reason was adequate or not.
Which all will lead to more threadcrapping. As we know, threadcrapping kills a lot of good threads.
2) As people mentioned, why people think that making others give a reason for a thumbs down will make the malicious votes stop. People will just say things like price is not good enough or bad product, etc which may or may not be true. you can't force people to provide meaningful reason or prevent people lie about their reason
3) The number of abuse is insignificant. If it is not broken, why change it and possibly make it worse?
As more votes are cast, the tally reflects the consensus.
4) Many people mentioned they would not bother giving thumbs up or down anymore if I had to spend extra time giving a drawn out explaination to why I'm rating it (many normal people will stop voting) . But those abuser will keep voting with comment like "deal is not good". Actually easier for those abuser to vote down a thread since much less people vote.
5) There are just as many people give thumbs up for deals that is not hot. If 'Thumbs down' explanation is mandatory, the same should do with thumbs up. Some people thumbs up just because the effort which has nothing to do with the deal hot or not. Some thumbs up may be because of a funny comment in the post. Some thumbs up because they mentioned something about their school/college. Or some do it because the poster is their friend. Or thumbs up because of cool product (may not be good price), etc.
Some people like to give thumbs up just because it is the best price at the moment. But best price at the moment doesn't mean hot deal. If they thumbs up just because it is best price at the moment, some people don't want to count their thumbs up just as much as those thumbs down abuser.
For example, the average sale price for this item is $90 (normal price $100). They are on sale once every few weeks. The hot deals price every 6 months is like $60. So someone post a deal for that item when one store sell it for $90, it may be lowest price at the moment but definitely not hot deal. I want to know they they thumbs up because they think it is the best price at the moment and not because they know it is the hot deal price (which is as low as $60 for the last 6 months).
If we want best price at the moment, we can use PriceGrabber or similar site.
6) As some people mentioned, people expect too much out of the tu/td system. Take it with a grain of salt and don't get bent out of shape if you don't get the results you want.
7) don't want to people keep bumping up bad deals to explain why they thumb down the deal. If it is bad deal, they should NOT be bump up just to explain why the deal is bad. Especially someone else already mentioned it in the reply.
|
Quote from Xnarg Requiring reasons for tu/td would not improve the quality of the deals nor would it improve the quality of tu/td votes. :It would just invite infinite and lame arguments over whether or not someone's reason was adequate or not. If you don't like tu/td voting, then don't pay attention to it. In general, the votes are failry accurate, particularly as they get higher in number. A wise slickdealer knows to look beyond the facade of a tu/td vote. What is good for the crowd may not be good for him, and vice versa. Some people have way too much of their identity and their feelings invested in what votes their threads receive. Of course there are abuses, but name ONE system that can't be abused. This is reflective of the social pressure to offend no one even if it means not achieving anything. |
|
Quote from Xnarg There are a lot of votes in the poll for requiring people to explain thumbs down votes. I can't believe that these voters have thought this issue through. Do you really want to see dozens or hundreds of meaningless repetitions of the same words? :Suppose there is a deal that involves a large rebate from TigerDirect and it gets 20 TU and 100 TD votes. You'd have 100 people saying things like, "I don't trust their rebates,"and you'd have 20 people saying, "I've had no problems with their rebates."Nothing is to be gained by requiring commentary. People will post in the thread if they want. The TU/TD vote is not intended to replace commentary. You can't force people to make meaningful statements. If you think you're going to cut out petty voting with a commentary requirement, you're mistaken. A good slickdealer knows to look beyond the TU/TD vote. He or she may be one of those few who likes that deal, even though the majority don't. A resourceful slickdealer knows not to get his or her feelings hurt by a negative initial response, too. |
Once a Thread Wiki is added to a thread, "Create Wiki" button will disappear. If you would like to learn more about Thread Wiki feature, click here.
This is NOT hot deal forum. This thread is about opinion of this subject. So it is OK to summarize what has been posted and put it here.
If the first post is PROS of the idea, it make total sense to put the summary of CONS of the idea right next to his (on the first page) instead of reading 3-4 pages to find out all the CONS.
Last edited by uscpsycho; 09-14-2008 at 05:50 PM..
|
08-17-2007, 01:14 PM
|
#3 |
|
Not a bad idea at all. I'd give this thread a thumbs up.
|
|
|
08-17-2007, 02:37 PM
|
#4 |
|
I vote for option (3)
The reasons for giving thumbs-down should also be selectable from a predefined list - - thread title incorrect - not a deal at all!! - incorrect description in OP - no links given - asking for reps etc... This will also allow the thread-starter to see the reasons for his/her thread getting thumbs down without having to see who did it (giving the names could potentially lead to retribution - a definite possibility!) and more importantly, he/she will know what they did wrong!! There should also be the possibility to notify by email so that if the thread title/description/links get updated, the person who gave the thumbs-down initially has a chance to review his decision. Note that a a deal is a deal, be it slick or hot or warm. There are always people interested in a deal, even if it is not slick. Giving a thumbs down for a not-slick deal is wrong, IMO. |
|
|
08-17-2007, 02:43 PM
|
#5 | |
However, I don't think the SD community would go for such a radical change. People would go bonkers if you took away their ability to TD. SD used to allow negative rep and they took it away because of abuse. I wonder how the users responded to that? Who was around back in the day of neg rep? Last edited by uscpsycho; 08-17-2007 at 03:00 PM.. |
||
|
08-17-2007, 03:52 PM
|
#6 |
|
The other options don't stop anything. These suggestions assume that either a) the person with malicious intent will be truthful, or b) some action will be taken if they are not.
Since neither is likely to be true, putting a reason will do nothing. Remove the thumbs down, make them available much further in the membership process, or get over it. |
|
|
08-17-2007, 10:25 PM
|
#7 |
|
Highly support, recently I had several thread got thumbs down for no reason. I want to know the reason. My IQ is 96% above the average, so I want to know what the 4% smart people thought. (I bet the people who gave thumbs down are stupid
 )
|
|
|
08-18-2007, 02:05 AM
|
#8 |
|
Mod and their commision; SD does not have a Cash Back linking program. Greed; things need to change. #2 and #3.
Last edited by redman; 08-18-2007 at 02:08 AM.. |
|
|
08-18-2007, 04:55 AM
|
#9 |
 Finally fed up uscpsycho? I remember seeing many deals by you and people thumbing it down.. that there should be a list on who gave the thumbs down..not necessarily a reason, since that could become troublesome, but a list kind of like a public poll, to see who gave thumbs down and see if there are repeat offenders, who do it often..
__________________
|
|
|
08-18-2007, 07:00 AM
|
#10 | |
Great idea to see if it is repeat offenders.
__________________
 LIBERAL-TY...........click here [reference.com] for clarityInput http://forums.slickdeals.net/show...3&t=571775 |
||
|
08-18-2007, 07:40 AM
|
#11 |
|
This is a great idea. I busted a TD bandit. This member went back on ALL of my posts dating back to 2 years prior and thumbed them all down. Then went and did the same to 3 other members. It was a retaliation type of thing b/c we remarked on all of the reposts that they were posting. After an investigation by the mods, it was discovered that this member totally abused the TD system. This member's voting privilege's have been revoked.
 It was only recently that SD made member's profile's public so that you could see their voting history. Luckily, my hunch panned out. Then a trend was spotted. It is harder to find the bandits in the bigger forums. But once you find one, you can usually find a trail. I am all for this leaving a reason why you TD a post. I have posted in here quite a bit on this issue. Isis even has a thread about being harassed by another member.....interesting reading.....same kind of stuff.
__________________
Dogs come into our lives to teach us about love.... they depart to teach us about loss. A new dog never replaces an old dog; it merely expands the heart. If you have loved many dogs, your heart is very big. |
|
|
08-18-2007, 08:58 AM
|
#12 | |
|
||
|
08-18-2007, 09:11 AM
|
#13 |
|
The thumbs down need to stay. When I'm browsing the forums and I see something slammed with five red thumbs, I know to skip that even though the thread title may seem to indicate a good deal.
I typically give thumbs down for things that flat out aren't any kind of a good deal. "In stock at or above MSRP" notifications posing as "hot deals" are particularly irritating. I don't care if it's a Tickle Me Elmo or a Wii... it's not a deal. Period. I think a lot of you are just overly sensitive to criticism. If someone wants to have a way to say they don't think you posted a good deal with a single click, even if you don't agree with it, what's wrong with that? Get over it. What I'm tired of is, when I first click on a thread that's been open for a while that already has a high thumbs up level, and there's almost always at least one post on the first page saying "why the thumbs down"? Look around... those are all over the place. Do people camp out waiting to see an early thumbs down to a new thread and make these posts? Anyway, I think this is a non issue. I haven't seen any "abuse" that has hindered my ability to find deals. I don't recall any thumbs down threads that I've ever clicked on that haven't deserved it. |
|
|
08-18-2007, 01:43 PM
|
#14 |
|
I still think removing the THUMBS DOWN option is the only way to stop the abuse COMPLETELY, however nobody much but me seems to like the idea so I give up on it.
As far as requiring giving a reason for a TD, that option is no good without the other one with it, making the person giving a thumbs down have his/her name shown on the thread as having voted TD. The "reason given" is silly alone, as like I've said previously in another thread, people will just click on anything as they just want to give a thumbs down ( and get their jollys ), since there's nothing there forcing them to be honest about the reason. They won't care what they choose, it still gives them the ability to give that TU, anyway. But at least along with this addition of requiring a reason, their user name then shows up on the thread as a "Thumbs Down" voter, it might at least cut down on some of the abuse. Not all, of course, as that doesn't take into consideration the bogus alt accounts held by many, just for this purpose of using anonymity to get by with harrassing another person by thumbing down all their threads. However, since my choice of getting rid of the THUMBS DOWN completely ( but leaving the thumbs up) is not one the options in your poll, I chose the dual one. ( the one having BOTH ) |
|
|
08-18-2007, 09:13 PM
|
#15 |
|
Definitely keep TD as an option. It definitely helps me skip over the threads that aren't actually hot deals. People have friviously TD'd my posts, but it really doesn't make much of a difference. If I post a good deal, there is always a net thumbs up, especially if it's a really good one. In fact, I've yet to have any of my threads receive a net thumbs down.
|
|
 Post Reply |
«
Previous Thread
|
Next Thread
»
| Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|
Similar Threads
|
||||
| Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
| Stopping Fleabayers From Stealing Deals | DealLurker | Site Questions, Issues or Suggestions | 6 | 12-15-2007 11:16 AM |
| Auto Zip code wiki feature for B&M Deals? | Devedander | Site Questions, Issues or Suggestions | 1 | 10-09-2007 07:48 PM |
| SD should have the option to remove threads from a forum. | unity311unity | Site Questions, Issues or Suggestions | 8 | 11-16-2006 05:49 AM |
| Change Slick Deals - Forum Column from Last Post to Newest Thread | mrlobo | Site Questions, Issues or Suggestions | 8 | 10-13-2004 01:01 PM |
All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:12 AM.
del.icio.us