Forum Thread

New House wiring

105 14 October 30, 2017 at 12:26 PM
We are building a new house and are coming up on our electrical walk through. The cost to run each cat5e run is $200 so we are only taking the option of conduit from basement to attic.

This is the layout of our hosue:

https://imgur.com/a/FDnI0

Would it be a good idea to utilize the linen closet upstairs (by the MBR entrance) and removing the smaller butlers panty(by the dining room) and converting that into a closet for electronics (router, patch panel etc.) and having the conduit run from the attic to the linen closet and down to the butlers pantry area?

Should we get multiple conduit runs? They are $500 each.

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#2
Your electrician/builder is making a pretty penny on you here. Can you DIY the conduit yourself? Smurf tube is really easy to run. Since you talking about running low voltage cable you don't need metal. Make sure your electrician knows this. 100 ft is $38 retail https://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlo.../100404116 This a drill and a hole saw and you go to town.

Are you running phone lines? Most often they use cat5 for that and you could just terminate them yourself.

Can you upload any larger images? It's hard to see and read the blue prints. In general you want the wiring closet to be centrally located if possible. If you design in locations to put access points you could really put it anywhere. For most homes it doesn't need to be a very large spot.
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#3
Quote from LiquidRetro
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Your electrician/builder is making a pretty penny on you here. Can you DIY the conduit yourself? Smurf tube is really easy to run. Since you talking about running low voltage cable you don't need metal. Make sure your electrician knows this. 100 ft is $38 retail https://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlo.../100404116 This a drill and a hole saw and you go to town.

Are you running phone lines? Most often they use cat5 for that and you could just terminate them yourself.

Can you upload any larger images? It's hard to see and read the blue prints. In general you want the wiring closet to be centrally located if possible. If you design in locations to put access points you could really put it anywhere. For most homes it doesn't need to be a very large spot.

Here are higher resolution pictures:
https://imgur.com/a/oqCv8

The house is in a development, so we can't have anyone else in it until closing. I was thinking about doing a few runs of conduit myself after the electrical inspection. But Im not sure how much I will be able to do.
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Yeah that is a rip off at $200 a run. My electrician charges $100 a run and that is with the walls up. With the walls open, running ethernet cable is a piece of cake imo. I would look to do as much of it as you can yourself if that is the case and if your builder does not give you a hard time about it. It is so much easier to run the wires with the walls open.

That said, assuming you have a basement, that is where I would run all the utility stuff (usually by the electrical panel). Run wall rated cat 6 (use cat 6 not cat5e imo as the cost is not that much more) to wherever in the basement and the first floor it needs to go. You can do that yourself with the walls open pretty easily if you can manage snaking a wire through a floor. When the walls go up, make sure they put boxes for the ethernet wires. Same for any TV\HDMI stuff you plan to mount on walls or over fireplaces and for any speaker wires you want to put in (there is nothing worse than not being able to easily run the rear speaker wires easily). Have them run the conduit to the attic in however many locations you think makes sense from the perspective of going from the attic down to the second floor rooms and have an electrician run the wires there afterwards. You generally would want to run ethernet to all rooms imo.

My 2 cents.
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#5
Depending what you're calling/using for conduit the inspector might fail you.
open areas from one floor to another=fire hazard in their book (not mine)
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#6
fark $200 for a run. Def. do yourself but be REALLY weary of code. Can you negotiate with electrician directly to get the $$ down?

Just be sure to do home runs from each room and put in stringers too.
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#7
Criminal rate for wiring a house before drywall. $5 in wire per drop, add a $1 mud ring, drill some holes, pull wire and staple in place. Seems like he wants to charge you in the neighborhood of $600/hr for labor.

Builders love change orders, because you already agreed to a price. Now they can charge whatever they want. It probably would have been much cheaper if you had asked for it before you signed the contract. Frown
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Quote from HarryH3
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Criminal rate for wiring a house before drywall. $5 in wire per drop, add a $1 mud ring, drill some holes, pull wire and staple in place. Seems like he wants to charge you in the neighborhood of $600/hr for labor.

Builders love change orders, because you already agreed to a price. Now they can charge whatever they want. It probably would have been much cheaper if you had asked for it before you signed the contract. Frown
This was the price prior to signing the contract. Seems like a standard price with builders (toll and hovnanian were around the same)
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Quote from YanksIn2009
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Yeah that is a rip off at $200 a run. My electrician charges $100 a run and that is with the walls up. With the walls open, running ethernet cable is a piece of cake imo. I would look to do as much of it as you can yourself if that is the case and if your builder does not give you a hard time about it. It is so much easier to run the wires with the walls open.

That said, assuming you have a basement, that is where I would run all the utility stuff (usually by the electrical panel). Run wall rated cat 6 (use cat 6 not cat5e imo as the cost is not that much more) to wherever in the basement and the first floor it needs to go. You can do that yourself with the walls open pretty easily if you can manage snaking a wire through a floor. When the walls go up, make sure they put boxes for the ethernet wires. Same for any TV\HDMI stuff you plan to mount on walls or over fireplaces and for any speaker wires you want to put in (there is nothing worse than not being able to easily run the rear speaker wires easily). Have them run the conduit to the attic in however many locations you think makes sense from the perspective of going from the attic down to the second floor rooms and have an electrician run the wires there afterwards. You generally would want to run ethernet to all rooms imo.

My 2 cents.
Problem is each conduit run will be $500. I can try to sneak it in after electrical inspection time permitting. If I run conduit from each of the bedrooms to the attic then can I run the cable to the attic and use the conduit that goes to the basement to send all the second floor cables to the panel in the basement?
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Quote from cliftonite
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This was the price prior to signing the contract. Seems like a standard price with builders (toll and hovnanian were around the same)

It is still criminal. Outside of the pain of going up a couple of floors, you can do it cheaper even with an electrician after the fact with the walls up. That being said, as I noted before, going to the attic from the basement after the floors are up is not worth the grief...much better to run a conduit or have the wires run properly with them open.
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Last edited by YanksIn2009 October 31, 2017 at 06:22 AM.
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Quote from cliftonite
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Problem is each conduit run will be $500. I can try to sneak it in after electrical inspection time permitting. If I run conduit from each of the bedrooms to the attic then can I run the cable to the attic and use the conduit that goes to the basement to send all the second floor cables to the panel in the basement?

You do not need to run separate conduits per bedroom. You can run one conduit large enough to run all the wires through. Then run the wires in your attic along the floor joists\supports or ceiling to the locations you want them and have an electrician snake them down to the second floor. Usually you can follow the electrical or coax wires (assuming those are being run by the contractor) down to the second floor as most of the time the contractors go up to the attic and down as well. If you need more wires than the conduit can fit, then you can setup an ethernet switch in your attic and run one of the wires from the conduit to it (you need an outlet to plug it in in the attic).
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Quote from cliftonite
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Here are higher resolution pictures:
https://imgur.com/a/oqCv8

The house is in a development, so we can't have anyone else in it until closing. I was thinking about doing a few runs of conduit myself after the electrical inspection. But Im not sure how much I will be able to do.
To follow up I would put it near the butlers pantry near the stairs. I don't think you need to remove the pantry just dedicate some space to it.
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#13
When my parents moved into a Sun City a few years ago, they had a freaking 3-ring BINDER for their change order pricing schedules...it was highway robbery!!! For the cost of 1 their drops, I was able to buy the RG-6 Coax and all the termination to cable up 4 rooms to 2 different DTV Satellite receivers. Yeah it was a dual run to each TV with a basic A/B coax switch, but it has worked fine. Only thing better would to have had multiple UHF remote controls for the 2 Sat Boxes vs. 1 each IR remotes.

As to the OP...I'd say have the sparky's put you in a conduit from the basement to the attic and you can run your stuff to each room after that.

If you put stuff in after the inspection, I bet you dollars to donuts that they will rip that shit out and then seal up the walls.

Speaking of walls...TAKE LOTS OF PICTURES of your walls where you intend to have an outlet so you know what the framing is if there is any fire-blocking to worry about.

Also note where you want to mount TV's. You might be able to sneak in some 2x4's where the TV will mount to make it easier.

/My 2 cents, the advice above is solid, this is just my take on it.

* I can't get imgur at work so I can't see your plans.
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Quote from YanksIn2009
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It is still criminal. Outside of the pain of going up a couple of floors, you can do it cheaper even with an electrician after the fact with the walls up. That being said, as I noted before, going to the attic from the basement after the floors are up is not worth the grief...much better to run a conduit or have the wires run properly with them open.
Their electricians work cheaper due to volume and simplified electrical layouts. Running that network cable takes time, the same time they could wire up half a house and make more money.

They usually run tight schedules too, so they might be delaying another house to run those wires.

I gutted and rewired my house and my electrician let me run network conduit everywhere myself, it was a ton of work but well worth it.
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Quote from MISHNAH
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Their electricians work cheaper due to volume and simplified electrical layouts. Running that network cable takes time, the same time they could wire up half a house and make more money.

They usually run tight schedules too, so they might be delaying another house to run those wires.

I gutted and rewired my house and my electrician let me run network conduit everywhere myself, it was a ton of work but well worth it.

It does not take a pro an hour to do a standard cable run. At $100 a run, even if it did take them an hour that is a pretty good rate. Yes they may charge you a little more if they have to deal with fire stops or difficult to get to areas though. They do have to make time to do your job vs. someone elses so they are more likely to want to schedule you quickly if you have a number of them to do, but not all electricians are busy every day of the week\are working a big job and you can always schedule well in advance as there is no rush to doing cable runs usually. When I had a half a dozen runs done previously, I combined it with some other minor work I wanted done (added an external motion light). Guy did the work in like 4 hours some of which was spent trying to figure out if he could run speaker wires to the back wall of my family room by going through the basement below. Unfortunately, the support beams and HVAC ducts were directly under that wall so there was no easy way to do that. He probably spent 40 minutes trying to figure that out and did not charge me for it.
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Last edited by YanksIn2009 October 31, 2017 at 09:03 AM.
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