Forum Thread

What does compromise look like in a polarizing society?

1,593 242 January 7, 2019 at 01:51 AM
I hear a lot in the media about the increasing polarization of the country and about how in the past parties came together to compromise and accomplish common goals. And I wondered what compromise even looks like with people that want to take from you and that you don't necessarily even share common goals with anymore? It seems to me any compromise there leaves you with less than what you started with and the other side with more than it started with. So what is it really possible to get the other side in such a compromise to give up that is worth as much to you are you are giving up?

As a concrete example Little Miss Socialist Alexandria wants a 70% income tax rate. The current highest marginal tax rate is 37%. Someone might say a compromise is to meet in the middle at 53.5%. But in that scenario the other side has given up nothing except for a demand. Is any real compromise workable in such a situation in the current environment? Do you forsee someone like her agreeing to mandatory spending reductions or a balanced budget amendment or even agreeing to using some of the additional funds projected to be raised be used for border security or the military? Would Republicans have any issues the Democrats would let them have their way on be worth that tax hike?

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#2
Ocasio's brand is being pushed so it can be controlled. She will be bought out and sell out. Just give it some time. They will reel her in.
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#3
Quote from northerlights
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I hear a lot in the media about the increasing polarization of the country and about how in the past parties came together to compromise and accomplish common goals. And I wondered what compromise even looks like with people that want to take from you and that you don't necessarily even share common goals with anymore? It seems to me any compromise there leaves you with less than what you started with and the other side with more than it started with. So what is it really possible to get the other side in such a compromise to give up that is worth as much to you are you are giving up?

As a concrete example Little Miss Socialist Alexandria wants a 70% income tax rate. The current highest marginal tax rate is 37%. Someone might say a compromise is to meet in the middle at 53.5%. But in that scenario the other side has given up nothing except for a demand. Is any real compromise workable in such a situation in the current environment? Do you forsee someone like her agreeing to mandatory spending reductions or a balanced budget amendment or even agreeing to using some of the additional funds projected to be raised be used for border security or the military? Would Republicans have any issues the Democrats would let them have their way on be worth that tax hike?
Like gun control - "compromise" is pro-2A giving up rights while the left gets at least some of what they want. Compromise would be both sides offering something, not capitulating to demands.
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#4
Quote from germanpope
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Ocasio's brand is being pushed so it can be controlled. She will be bought out and sell out. Just give it some time. They will reel her in.
Agreed. It seems just about every election there's some firebrand upstart that gets people motivated and is going to DC to change things. Then it's like they disappear off the face of the Earth.

That's when reality hits and the party shows them where their place is.
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#5
Quote from northerlights
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I hear a lot in the media about the increasing polarization of the country and about how in the past parties came together to compromise and accomplish common goals. And I wondered what compromise even looks like with people that want to take from you and that you don't necessarily even share common goals with anymore? It seems to me any compromise there leaves you with less than what you started with and the other side with more than it started with. So what is it really possible to get the other side in such a compromise to give up that is worth as much to you are you are giving up?

As a concrete example Little Miss Socialist Alexandria wants a 70% income tax rate. The current highest marginal tax rate is 37%. Someone might say a compromise is to meet in the middle at 53.5%. But in that scenario the other side has given up nothing except for a demand. Is any real compromise workable in such a situation in the current environment? Do you forsee someone like her agreeing to mandatory spending reductions or a balanced budget amendment or even agreeing to using some of the additional funds projected to be raised be used for border security or the military? Would Republicans have any issues the Democrats would let them have their way on be worth that tax hike?
i say the first requirement for compromise to even have a chance of happening is to stop name-calling those with whom you wish* to achieve a compromise.

BTW: your example is kinda (too) simple (minded) and likely an indication that you are trying to sabotage the very concept of compromise the same way that trump enthusiasts have sabotaged the idea of media and common fact and democracy and independent judiciary.

here is a better example: you want DACA, I want the wall...

* if indeed you "wish" so.
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"But you have to ask yourself how many times does one have to wake up the next day, look at what they've posted the night before, and repeatedly face shame and regret before not doing *that* anymore? LMAO" --BLUEKNOB, 9:36 pm Dec 12, 2017 on the eve of Alabama special election with Roy Moore as a candidate

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#6
Quote from TRNT
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i say the first requirement for compromise to even have a chance of happening is to stop name-calling those with whom you wish* to achieve a compromise.

BTW: your example is kinda (too) simple (minded) and likely an indication that you are trying to sabotage the very concept of compromise the same way that trump enthusiasts have sabotaged the idea of media and common fact and democracy and independent judiciary.

here is a better example: you want DACA, I want the wall...

* if indeed you "wish" so.
That's negotiation, not compromise.

Compromise is a plan that addresses a problem that both people can be ok with. Like "a wall but only in these places and under $X and with $Y to border security."
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#7
Quote from ASG
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That's negotiation, not compromise.

Compromise is a plan that addresses a problem that both people can be ok with. Like "a wall but only in these places and under $X and with $Y to border security."
i am not sure if I agree.

first of all the two need not be mutually exclusive.

second, here is how your "compromise" above is actually a "negotiation" as you seem to have described the terms: "the gov closing is hurting us both but more you than us so how about instead of giving you $5B we approve $2.5B and we open the gov?"
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#8
Quote from TRNT
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i am not sure if I agree.

first of all the two need not be mutually exclusive.

second, here is how your "compromise" above is actually a "negotiation" as you seem to have described the terms: "the gov closing is hurting us both but more you than us so how about instead of giving you $5B we approve $2.5B and we open the gov?"
Compromise is the 2.5 without the government closure threat.
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#9
Quote from ASG
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Compromise is the 2.5 without the government closure threat.
ok, i get it.

Compromise: you wanna go to Hawaii, i wanna go to aruba. so we compromise and go to jamaica. (nither gets what they want and both sides will remain unsastified.)

Negotiation: you wanna go to Hawaii and i wanna go to aruba. so in odd years we go to hawaii and even years to aruba.

i get it, maybe in marital relationships the difference is important but honestly I do not see the big deal about the difference.

lastly: if we take out the gov shut down from the equation, there is no incentive for the dems to "compromise" and give trump 5/2=2.5. i truly do not see the importance of the distinction in this particular case.

BTW and ironically, in the explain you give, trump indeed does get half of what he wanted.

lastly i do not deny the nuanced differences but I am wondering is this distinction is some kinda feel good nonsense mumbo-jumbo created by psychologists and marital therapists. in the brute and heartless business of governance and politics, it seems to me the discussion is a but without the difference.
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#10
Quote from TRNT
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ok, i get it.

Compromise: you wanna go to Hawaii, i wanna go to aruba. so we compromise and go to jamaica. (nither gets what they want and both sides will remain unsastified.)

Negotiation: you wanna go to Hawaii and i wanna go to aruba. so in odd years we go to hawaii and even years to aruba.
No, I'm saying both of those are compromise but its not compromise if you want to go to Hawaii and I want to watch football on Sundays (different topics).
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#11
Demand:
Mexico will pay 100% of the concrete Wall across the entire border

Compromise:
Mexico will pay 50% of the concrete Wall across half the border

Now we just need Mexico to start paying.
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#12
Quote from TRNT
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BTW: your example is kinda (too) simple (minded) and likely an indication that you are trying to sabotage the very concept of compromise the same way that trump enthusiasts have sabotaged the idea of media and common fact and democracy and independent judiciary.
Please consider this was done in genuine good faith. I legitimately am struggling to see how compromise works in cases where one side seems at risk of losing something they already had in any deal that is struck and not necessarily getting anything it values enough to be worth what it is giving up.

Guns are a good example. One side wants an "assault weapons" ban. The other side doesn't. What does compromise look like here? One side is giving away rights it doesn't want to give away and what it gets in return is never anything that side would have initiated the compromise to get on its own.

The pro-ban side is happy to incrementally strip rights away because what is it really giving up in return? The last time this happened Federally the pro-ban side was willing to accept a grandfather clause and a sunset clause, but what did the anti-ban side get of value? The grandfather clause merely let them keep what they already legally owned, so they're no better off than when they started.
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#13
Where is "compromise" when the leftists use the activist courts legislating from the bench and using "executive orders" to get what they want without going through congress?
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#14
Quote from USAman
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Where is "compromise" when the leftists use the activist courts legislating from the bench and using "executive orders" to get what they want without going through congress?
Kind of sounds like what Trump is talking about doing to get his wall, right? And you say leftists do this? Reps do it too, correct?
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#15
Quote from USAman
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Where is "compromise" when the leftists use the activist courts legislating from the bench and using "executive orders" to get what they want without going through congress?
You have just described the actions following the failed repeal of Obamacare. The irony....
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