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dry loop DSL, ooma hub, and in-house phone 2-pair wiring

teetee1 1,975 918 August 11, 2010 at 09:34 PM
I am in the process of switching the current Verizon landline and Verizon DSL to dry loop DSL Internet plus Ooma hub(I don't have scout) for phone calls. Since the current phone wiring supports multiple phones physically located in different rooms and the wires are 2-pair wiring(2 lines), it makes sense to connect the phone wiring to ooma so that the current telephones can be used as before. The normal wiring setup as suggested by Ooma is like this:
http://www.ooma.com/support/knowl...hone-jacks

However there is no details explaining how this should be done, so today I did some research on the phone wiring:
wikipedia link on RJ14(2-line) color code - line1: green(pin3),red(pin4); line2: black(pin2),yellow(pin5)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regi...ck#Pinouts

Photos below show the NID wiring outside of the house. There are two lines coming out of the customer side(the 2nd half-ringer) and both have their line1(green and red) connected.
http://s963.photobucket.com/album...zon%20NID/

From
http://www.wire-your-phones.com/
"Converting a "Line 1" jack to a "Line 2" jack " section:
"Note that black is swapped for green, and yellow is swapped for red. Of course, it would also work if you consistently swapped the black and yellow wires the other way (black for red, yellow for green) but that is not the standard. Given that you have to be consistent between the two ends of the wire, you might as well follow the standard. "

My plan is as below:
http://s963.photobucket.com/album...erdiag.png

Any suggestions?

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#2
Ah, one of my specialties!

I have DSL (digital) on the same line as Landline Voice (analog) on the middle pair (inner pair [red and green]) and then back-feeding Ooma to the scout at the same jack where the DSL comes in, but on the outer pair (outside pair [black and yellow]). See below about the 2-line telephone splitter L1, L2, L1+L2.

Note that the Ooma Hub to Scout cant be on the same pair as DSL as they are both digital signals and will conflict with each other. Either way, you cant/shouldnt put the Ooma Hub analog (phone out) or digital (Scout out) signal on the same line as DSL, else a teleco repair guy might 'accidentally' connect a teleco. powered analog voice line to the same line as your Ooma and it might fry it.

It looks like you have 2 inside jacks coming out of the box outside of the house, one with old wiring (brownish cable) and the other with new wiring (tan cable).

I noticed that on the inside old jack the terminals are majorly corroded so if you ever experience DSL problems that will be the first thing to replace.

In the outside box you will want to remove the yellow and black wires from their plugs of both of the lines going into the house. Connect the yellow wire from the old jack cable (brownish) to the yellow wire of the newer tan cable. Also, connect the black wire from the old cable to the black wire of the newer cable. What you have just done is make a loop from the old jack (inside) to the new jack (inside), through the telephone box outside. Label it that Ooma is on the yellow and black pair so a telephone repair guy knows and doesnt do something to fry your Ooma.

What I did was use a 2-line telephone splitter [abccables.com]. L1, L2, L1+L2
I bought mine at home deport for around $5.

L1 is your DSL (red and green) coming in.
L2 is back-feeding the Ooma digital signal on the second pair (black and yellow). In your case you will be back-feeding the Ooma analog telephone out.

Now what you may want to do is flip the pairs at the jack where DSL is on L2 and Ooma is on L1, so that you don't have to change the wiring at the other jack(s) or use a line splitter there also.

If you need any clarifications and/or have more questions just ask away.
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Last edited by greenmeansgoooo August 11, 2010 at 11:23 PM.
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#3
Quote from greenmeansgoooo View Post :
Okay, first of all, I have DSL (digital) on the same line as Landline Voice (analog) on the middle pair (inner pair [red and green]) and then backfeeding Ooma to the scout, which is digital (and can't be on the same line as DSL [digital]) on the outer pair [black and yellow].

Okay first thing I noticed is that the inside jack terminal are majorly corroded so if you ever experience DSL problems that will be the first thing to replace.

It looks like you have 2 inside jacks coming out of the box outside of the house, one with old wiring and the other with new wiring..
Wow you have really good eyes! I appreciate the detailed findings.

As I understand from your wiring description, your DSL and landline use the same pair(green/red) while the line goes from your Ooma to scout use line2(black/yellow).

Your concept is exactly the same but the line pair choice is opposite from mine. I don't have a scout and don't plan to have one (really don't need it and not plan to pay for the ooma premier service either) but I do need multiple physical analog phone hook-up locations for me and my roommates.

That's why I wanted to use yellow/black for the DSL and the line comes out of ooma hub uses the red/green so that all the oldschool phones don't need the line converter(line2->line1) to be able to get the dialtone.

As for the 2nd floor rusty modular phone jack, I already ordered one from ebay. My current 1M/384k DSL gives good DL/UL rates but I would rather get the jack replaced before I encounter problems.

Yes there are two in-house phone lines coming from NID and my guess is the old one is for the 1st floor phone wiring. I don't see the black wire of that one at NID but luckily I am planning to put the DSL modem, router, and Ooma on the 2nd floor, which has all four wires at the NID.

I can't wait for Ooma hub to come so that I can finish the activation and number porting before I disconnect Verizon phone and switch Verizon DSL to DSL Extreme before school starts.
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Yep, you can put the incoming DSL (red/green) at the NIC immediately on the yellow/black pair of the line that goes to the jack that you want to plug the DSL modem into. Just keep in mind that at the actual jack now the DSL is on line2 (L2) and you either need a 2-line splitter to extract it or splice in a secondary jack to change it back to line1 (L1). Then all you have to do is disconnect the red/green pairs of the 2 lines that go into the house and tie those together, looping through the NIC box.

Now at the jack were you have the DSL coming in on the yellow/black pair, do you plan on using a splitter to plug into the single jack, to access L1 (Ooma back-feed [red/green]), L2 (DSL [yellow/black]))? Else, will you be connecting a secondary jack, 1 jack for DSL, the other to back-feed the Ooma analog telephone signal?

I've had Ooma for almost a year and I've only seen it go offline once, that wasn't DSL's fault, for about 10-15 minutes.
Alarm system works fine on Ooma.
When dialing a number press # after the number to force the number to go through immediately also there is about a 3 second delay.

BTW, Red = Ring, Green = Tip in TeleCo terminology. The way I remember that is that red and ring are R's.
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Last edited by greenmeansgoooo August 11, 2010 at 11:46 PM.
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Hey thanks for the ooma dialling and the wire color memorizing tips!

The "loopback" is done on the splitter. That's where my customized splitter comes in to play.



The input end(the single) of the splitter goes into the wall jack where the DSL signal comes in from NID ( I will definitely replace that rusty wall jack! ).

The DSL output of the splitter has the yellow/black wires from the NID located at pin3,4 to send in the DSL signal for the modem. Since the red/green wires on the same line from NID to the splitter are actually part of the in-house phone wiring so I place them far away from the DSL wires on the same splitter output(hence pin1,6) since the line from NID to DSL output of the splitter don't use green/red wires at all.
http://i963.photobucket.com/album...lipped.jpg
http://s963.photobucket.com/album...erdiag.png

The diagram also shows how I am going to connect ooma to the existing network setup. Then the diatone signal will travel through Ooma hub to the end labelled as "phone" of the same splitter. At this end I keep the pin3,4 the same as the original(red and green) but move the yellow and black wires to the far end(pin1,6) so that the DSL signal would not interfere the rest of the household phones.

Since I close the red and green wires of the in-house phone lines at the NID box(red to red, green to green), the ooma phone signal from the splitter should not travel back to the whole red/green phone wiring of the house.

I figure by using this customized splitter, the house wiring has minimum impact. In the future if I want to revert it back, I just have to remove the splitter from the wall jack on the 2nd floor, remove the yellow/black wires and reattach the red/green wires at the NID box then everything goes back to original.
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Last edited by teetee1 August 12, 2010 at 08:59 AM.
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Okay now I understand what you are doing - taking the splitter apart and customizing the wiring to the pins. Before I thought the pic was from inside your NIC (thought it looked strange).

In the NIC you should remove the red/green pairs (house cables) from the telephone terminals and combine the 2 pairs with 2 small wire nuts (caps) so that there is no chance of phone power being 'accidentally' applied.

I went back and looked at the pictures of your NIC. I was checking to make sure there is a ground wire, which there is, and even a little black wire running to the customer side of the NIC. Also, from what I can tell, did/do you have 2 phone lines coming in, as there is a blue/blue-white (line 1) and orange/orange-white (line 2)? DSL on line 1?

When i had DSL installed about 2 years ago the tech put a couple globs of clear silicone on the inside of the NIC where the wires come in, to keep the buggies out. I see you have some bug activity in your NIC.
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Last edited by greenmeansgoooo August 12, 2010 at 11:49 AM.
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OP, did you get it all wired up?
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#8
I think I have almost the same issue. I have dry loop DSL from AT&T. I want to use either the Ooma Scout and connect it to my Dish Network receiver or be able to plug my receiver directly into the phone jack as before. (One Note) When I still had landline service, I had to use one of those wireless phone jacks because I didn't have a phone jack close to my Dish Receiver. I would like to use that same setup if it is at all possible?

From what I can see you guys know your stuff, but I'm still a little lost with the whole setup. I need something like Cliff notes or Ooma setup for dummies!

My Ooma service does work and my DSL works perfectly as well, just how do I get the Dish hooked up?

Thank you in advance for your help.
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Yes, your wireless phone jack should work with Ooma. Just plug the telephone line from that transmitter box into the "telephone" port of the Ooma Hub. If you want to also plug in a cordless phone you can get a telephone splitter on either end or both.
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Quote from greenmeansgoooo View Post :
OP, did you get it all wired up?
Not yet. I am still waiting for the Ooma device to arrive. I cleaned out the NID box and apply some weather seal on the edge of the box to prevent anything from getting in. The 2nd floor phone jack is also replaced. The wiring has been tested and known to work so the only thing missing is the Ooma hub.

By the way, I am still not sure where I should put the Ooma hub. From what I've read people seem to have different opinions and results. Some think Ooma hub should be placed between the DSL modem and the router because the hub offers QoS for the voice. Some think the hub should be behind the router if the router has QoS built-in (mine has WRT54GL w/ tomato QoS) because they worry about the hub's ability for other network traffic passthrough (My current DSL plan is 1M/384k but I am thinking to upgrade it to 3M/512K). The others think the hub should be behind the router and in the router settings put the hub in DMZ so that the hub can still have the QoS function while the router is responsible for the rest of the traffic. It seems they all have good points.

One thing for sure is that I will be getting right onto testing the VOIP after the hub arrives. Maybe I will use this thread for ooma review write-up.
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Last edited by teetee1 August 15, 2010 at 01:38 AM.
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I have my hub behind the ATT DSL Gateway (modem/router). This is probably why there is echo/popping on Ooma when I have the bandwidth near maxed out.

I have already purchased some of the 1-2 jack splitters so I can pop them open and rewire them like you did. the 1-2 splitters are much cheaper then the L1,L2,L1+L2 splitters that I bought for $5 each.

I like the idea of bringing in DSL on the second pair (yellow/black). That way the VOIP can be back-fed on the existing first pair (red/green) without any modifications to other jacks.
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Quote from greenmeansgoooo View Post :
I have my hub behind the ATT DSL Gateway (modem/router). This is probably why there is echo/popping on Ooma when I have the bandwidth near maxed out.

I have already purchased some of the 1-2 jack splitters so I can pop them open and rewire them like you did. the 1-2 splitters are much cheaper then the L1,L2,L1+L2 splitters that I bought for $5 each.

I like the idea of bringing in DSL on the second pair (yellow/black). That way the VOIP can be back-fed on the existing first pair (red/green) without any modifications to other jacks.
When I tried to open one of those 1-2 jack splitters by pressing the 4 tabs on the side that hold the splitter together, I must have pressed them too hard because two of them broke. That's one thing I could have done differently.

I also made another wiring diagram which should be more clear than the previous one I made:
http://i963.photobucket.com/album...Wiring.png
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Quote from teetee1 View Post :
When I tried to open one of those 1-2 jack splitters by pressing the 4 tabs on the side that hold the splitter together, I must have pressed them too hard because two of them broke. That's one thing I could have done differently.

I also made another wiring diagram which should be more clear than the previous one I made:
http://i963.photobucket.com/album...Wiring.png
the new diagram is better.

nothing a couple drops of super glue can't fix.
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Quote from teetee1 View Post :
When I tried to open one of those 1-2 jack splitters by pressing the 4 tabs on the side that hold the splitter together, I must have pressed them too hard because two of them broke. That's one thing I could have done differently.

I also made another wiring diagram which should be more clear than the previous one I made:
http://i963.photobucket.com/album...Wiring.png
Kinda nitpicking here since it's not connected, but you have the polarity reversed on the DSL side with the red green pair.

Also I'm a bit curious about your choice in using a splitter. since you are replacing the jack anyway, why not get a plate with two jacks in it and wire one pair to each jack only?

http://www.monoprice.com/products...1&format=2
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Last edited by ecom August 16, 2010 at 01:32 AM.
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Quote from ecom View Post :
Kinda nitpicking here since it's not connected, but you have the polarity reversed on the DSL side with the red green pair.

Also I'm a bit curious about your choice in using a splitter. since you are replacing the jack anyway, why not get a plate with two jacks in it and wire one pair to each jack only?

http://www.monoprice.com/products...1&format=2
The wires in the splitter were originally arranged in a way that if I do it according to my wiring diagram(instead of the photo with letter labels), one of the wire terminals (I forgot if it was green or the red wire) would be too short. It's the same reason why the black and yellow wires were flipped on the "phone" end of the splitter. In other words both the diagram and the photo will work. They just have slightly different pin-out order.

The two-jack plate sounds like a nice idea. However the house I live in is a rental so I can't really change the surface-mounted box into a wall plate. If I were to modify the jack directly, I would probably use a 2-jack surface mount box with a couple of keystones.
http://www.monoprice.com/products...1&format=2

There is about 20 feet from the jack (which is in the 2nd floor hallway) to the network equipment area in my room so I'd rather use one extension cord with the splitter instead of running two phone cords on the hallway.

I just learned that my ooma hub will be arriving tomorrow so is the new DSL activation. Once things are set up, it will probably take another two weeks to port the old phone number(according to ooma discussion forum) over to ooma and some time (god knows how long) on the phone with Verizon to change my DSL to dry-loop and terminate my DSL account with them. If everything works out, I will be paying no more than $30/mo. for 3M/512k DSL with no monthly fee for domestic phone calls. It's a big leap comparing to the current plan (1M DSL + local phone plan from Verizon for $47/mo.)

Honestly I've been happy with Verizon DSL line quality and stability for the past three years. It's the price(especially the fees) for their phone service, the customer service, and the aggressive way they try to push FIOS to me that I can't stand. I was on the phone with them this morning asking if my DSL plan is month-by-month or by 1-yr contract. During the five-minute conversation, the rep. tried to get me to switch to FIOS package THREE times ($99/mo.) After the call it made me wonder how long in the future we will still have our copper phone wires. It's like everybody is speed-craving but nobody talks about low-cost, basic internet plan any more (just ranting).
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Last edited by teetee1 August 16, 2010 at 09:23 PM.
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