Gun Incident Mega Thread - Post All Gun Incidents Here

Quote from gunnerusa : Talk is cheap.

By all means feel free to study.

http://slickdeals.net/f/5837754-T...ns-at-Home

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgaga.html

http://www.guncite.com/Kellerman93Letters.html

Quote from paperboy05 : By all means feel free to study. http://slickdeals.net/f/5837754-T...ns-at-Home http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgaga.html

I cited plenty of more recent studies than the study your articles attempt, but fail, to refute.

Quote from gunnerusa : I cited plenty of more recent studies than the study your articles attempt, but fail, to refute.

You provided one from 2004, the other was from '94 just as old as the refuted Kellerman "study".

And the Oxford journal study leaves themselves open for refutation:

Quote : Third, it is possible that the association between a gun in the home and risk of a violent death may be related to other factors that we were unable to control for in our analysis. For instance, with homicide, the association may be related to certain neighborhood characteristics or the decedent’s previous involvement in other violent or illegal behaviors. Persons living in high-crime neighborhoods or involved in illegal behaviors may acquire a gun for protection. The risk comes not necessarily from the presence of the gun in the house but from these types of environmental factors and exposures.

And again, none of these studies support your notion about such events being "typical".

Quote from paperboy05 : If this is the line of reasoning that is going to be continually used, I advocate this thread just be closed.

You don't get rid of a thread because of one person. You get rid of the person.

Quote from gunnerusa : Another typical outcome for shootings involving "home defense" weapons:

Legal gun owners and their families are safer with guns kept in the home.
Women are less likely to be victims of abuse if armed as well.

the studies showing increased danger are methologically a joke.
The use some combination or all of:
a) not counting brandishing or showing of a weapon, which police will tell you is what they do 1000 times for every time they fire. A crime stopped by a legal gun owner showing a weapon to an attacker doesn't count in these studies, when that is obviously the majority of incidents.

Method for showing guns are dangerous to owners: don't count the most prevalent incidents which don't support the predetermined thesis.

b) don't remove the incidents where the "owner" is a criminal. Leave in a crack dealer shooting another crack dealer trying to rob the house of crack dealer number 1. Crack addict falls asleep with gun he uses to rob people in his jacket. His 5 year old picks it up and shoots himself.

c) count suicides. Ignore the fact that their are westernized modern countries with virtually no guns and double the suicide rate. Dont mention that in japan people gas themselves often harming their neighbors as well.

Quote from gunnerusa : Yet another typical outcome for those who have weapons in the home: http://www.usatoday.com/story/new...e/1927815/ No, I cited academic, peer reviewed, scientifically valid studies.

Sounds to me like she shouldn't have had a gun - if you've tried a few times to kill yourself, you're not mentally "right".

Quote from gunnerusa : Not to mention cases where the abusive husband "reminds" his wife about his gun, and "suggests" that she not report the beatings.

Your red herring actually defeats your argument. Weapons are equalizers. That is why the number of guns owned by women is skyrocketing.

Women are already generally physically much weaker. Men beat their wives to death they don't shoot them. Women tend to stab or shoot their husbands (either in self defense or otherwise)

throwing in red herrings as you did is sad.

The fact is the first amendment kills more American kids than the assault rifles, and the fourth, fifth, sixth and eight cause more violent crime than the second as well.

Do you advocate we tax defendants defense lawyer charges to fund studies of how the fifth amendment causes more crime? Shall we suspend the fifth amendment to save kids? shall we call the ACLU callous, extreme, and a industry front when they object?

We are going to pull video games off the shelf right? they are the root of all this,

Quote from Dr. J : Sounds to me like she shouldn't have had a gun - if you've tried a few times to kill yourself, you're not mentally "right".

exactly. the left has opposed adding suicide risks to the FBI list.
and gun ownership and suicide risk are not related. Areas with lowest gun ownership often have double the suicide rate of areas with the highest legal ownership.

Quote from aero : Your red herring actually defeats your argument. Weapons are equalizers. That is why the number of guns owned by women is skyrocketing. Women are already generally physically much weaker. Men beat their wives to death they don't shoot them. Women tend to stab or shoot their husbands (either in self defense or otherwise) throwing in red herrings as you did is sad. The fact is the first amendment kills more American kids than the assault rifles, and the fourth, fifth, sixth and eight cause more violent crime than the second as well. Do you advocate we tax defendants defense lawyer charges to fund studies of how the fifth amendment causes more crime? Shall we suspend the fifth amendment to save kids? shall we call the ACLU callous, extreme, and a industry front when they object? We are going to pull video games off the shelf right? they are the root of all this, the left has opposed adding suicide risks to the FBI list

I don't know the correct way to mitigate the "crazy" risk angle though.... especially for those that have guns and then have mental issues afterward.

Quote from aero : Your red herring actually defeats your argument. Weapons are equalizers. That is why the number of guns owned by women is skyrocketing. Women are already generally physically much weaker. Men beat their wives to death they don't shoot them. Women tend to stab or shoot their husbands (either in self defense or otherwise)

Quote : American women are killed by intimate partners (husbands, lovers, ex-husbands, or ex-lovers) more often than by any other type of perpetrator.2–4 Intimate partner homicide accounts for approximately 40% to 50% of US femicides but a relatively small proportion of male homicides (5.9%).1,5–10 The percentage of intimate partner homicides involving male victims decreased between 1976 and 1996, whereas the percentage of female victims increased, from 54% to 72%.4 The majority (67%–80%) of intimate partner homicides involve physical abuse of the female by the male before the murder, no matter which partner is killed.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/a...MC1447915/

Quote from Deusxmachina : You don't get rid of a thread because of one person. You get rid of the person.

Fair enough. I do still enjoy learning new things in these types of threads.

Quote from gunnerusa : Yet another typical outcome for those who have weapons in the home:

Not typical at all, statistically speaking, as I supported with the math and links in another response earlier.

Even if all violent criminals came from the "law abiding gun owner" pool and "snapped," (which is patently false) 99.98925% of the gun owners in question did not commit homicides with their firearms in 2011, and 99.9997% of guns in the U.S. were not used for homicide in 2011 (with the #s skewed in your favor and assumptions stated above). See the stats I posted here. Lifetime odds of death from firearms discharge in 2007 per the NSC: 1 in 6,309 or 0.016%.

So no, not typical.

Quote : No, I cited academic, peer reviewed, scientifically valid studies.

Where? Which studies?

If you're talking about the Femicide article, wouldn't it be handy for those women to have a gun? And if they get a restraining order and a CPL, wouldn't it be nice if the newspaper didn't publish their names, addresses, and the fact that they own firearms so that their psycho exes couldn't track them down & kill them?

Joe pushing for more shotgun ownership...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/201...19330.html

Quote : "You don't need an AR-15," he said. "Buy a shotgun! Buy a shotgun!"

Quote : During a Facebook Town Hall hosted by Parents magazine, Biden took a handful of questions from readers about gun violence. One questioner named Kate asked how gun owners would be able to sufficiently protect themselves if Congress passed a bill banning certain weapons and high-capacity gun magazines. "Kate, if you want to protect yourself, get a double barreled shotgun," Biden responded. "I promise you, as I told my wife, we live in an area that's wooded and somewhat secluded. I said, Jill, if there's ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony here, walk out, put [up] that double barreled shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house." The vice president said that by firing two shotgun blasts, anyone who might be trying to break in would be scared off.

Quote from OhNoItsDEVO : "Kate, if you want to protect yourself, get a double barreled shotgun," Biden responded. "I promise you, as I told my wife, we live in an area that's wooded and somewhat secluded. I said, Jill, if there's ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony here, walk out, put [up] that double barreled shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house." The vice president said that by firing two shotgun blasts, anyone who might be trying to break in would be scared off.

Holy shit Joe Biden is a moron.

Quote from Deusxmachina : Holy shit Joe Biden is a moron.

After all of the crap that has effluviated from his orifice, you are just figuring that out? He is the best life insurance policy that Obama could ever have. He's probably the just about only man avail that could eff up the country more right now.