NYT endorses Obama's minimum wage proposal, but called for scrapping it in 1987....

Quote from TRNT : Do you really claim that a say 20% increase in min wage cause 20% inflation and 20% rise in poverty level.

the number of people on welfare is constantly going up, unemployment is still high, and burger combos are not $3.50 anymore.


to quote:

Quote from 124nic8 : We've had steady growth ever since....

Yep, of

1.) the national deficit
2.) foreclosures
3.) debt defaults
4.) welfare recipients

It would help them in some ways, and not in others. It might help them with rent or medical. Prices of cheap items will likely increase at about the same rate as the min wage increase. Yes, those fast food prices will go up. For a period of time, it may become more difficult to get a min wage job. Some jobs will be cut.

Raising the minimum wage will help lock in inflation, which the government needs. Since so many things that we spend money on are not tied into inflation calculations, the increase may appear significant.

Raising the minimum wage also helps shrink the between the rich and poor and redistributes wealth.

Quote from TRNT : 1. Let's stipulate that raising the min wage causes some inflation. So say a full time worker on min wage earns X% of poverty level. Now we increase the min wage to $9 and you say this causes inflation and increase in poverty level. So now the $9/hr min wage earner is at Y% of poverty level. Don't you think that Y would be grater than X? That is, even stipulating inflation and rise in poverty level, the min wage workers will be helped?

There are two problems. First, you can see the effects, and it's easy to envision a $1 rise in minimum wage as far as it puts $1 dollar extra per hour worked. You don't see the rise in prices. You don't see the cut back in hours. You don't see the rise in unemployment among those who need jobs the most and the jobs not created because they have to pay $9.00 instead of $8.00.

It's not possible to say if x% is greater or less than y%, nor is it possible to pretend the other consequences of such a law don't exist.

Quote from TRNT : 2. Some one mentioned reducing welfare programs in order to help the economy. Is it far-fetched to think that increasing min wage would relieve some of the pressure on welfare programs?

It's also impossible to say. If it increases unemployment among the poorest, I'd say it'd probably hurt.

Quote from Danman114 : There are two problems. First, you can see the effects, and it's easy to envision a $1 rise in minimum wage as far as it puts $1 dollar extra per hour worked. You don't see the rise in prices. You don't see the cut back in hours. You don't see the rise in unemployment among those who need jobs the most and the jobs not created because they have to pay $9.00 instead of $8.00. It's not possible to say if x% is greater or less than y%, nor is it possible to pretend the other consequences of such a law don't exist. It's also impossible to say. If it increases unemployment among the poorest, I'd say it'd probably hurt.

I agree with most everything you said except for this: I think it is near certainty that Y is greater than X.

Quote from TRNT : 2. Some one mentioned reducing welfare programs in order to help the economy. Is it far-fetched to think that increasing min wage would relieve some of the pressure on welfare programs?

This will result in inflation which will increase the cost of living which will then result in lower income requirements to qualify for welfare. And then we're right back to "needing" to increase the min wage again.

Quote from riznick : Raising the minimum wage also helps shrink the between the rich and poor and redistributes wealth.

Is it only "redistribution" when the gap is closed?

Or just when the government is involved?

Who here would prefer the gap to widen (even more than it has)?

Quote from TRNT : I agree with most everything you said except for this: I think it is near certainty that Y is greater than X.

Unless he loses his job, or gets his hours scaled back, which is why you can't say with any certainty one way or the other.

You just have to relish in the misery then caused to the rest of society in higher prices.

Quote from andyfico : This will result in inflation which will increase the cost of living which will then result in lower income requirements to qualify for welfare. And then we're right back to "needing" to increase the min wage again.

Really? We "need" to increase min wage again because of:

1. inflation,or
2. increase in the cost of living, or
3. lower income requirements to qualify for welfare?

(And I do not see #3 either.)

Quote from Danman114 : Unless he loses his job, or gets his hours scaled back, which is why you can't say with any certainty one way or the other.

Correct.....but other than for those two cases, it is a certainty. Right?

just to add I did read a story about some companies complaining. I remember one of the companies being a type of 7-11 type mini mart and had employees making below and above the federal minimum wage.

Their claim was that the increase would place would force them to increase the pay structure for all the employees. Their profit margins are extremely slim and their only choice would be to cut employees or go out of business.

What's occurring is pretty common sense that I've stated.. hundreds of times. By raising lower incomes you affect the majority, because of their size they feel the brunt of cost increases. By vastly taxing the upper class you bring them slightly closer to middle. You're trying to fit everyone into the bell curve.. but since there are so many lower class individuals the average income ends up with a slight shift downward. (whether it be directly income wise, or increased cost of living).

Quote from TRNT : Really? We "need" to increase min wage again because of: 1. inflation,or 2. increase in the cost of living, or 3. lower income requirements to qualify for welfare? (And I do not see #3 either.)

Why do YOU think we need to raise the minimum wage?

Yeah, the NY Times publishes both conservative and liberal editorial pieces. The editorials don't necessarily reflect a unified mind known as "New York Times."

Quote from andyfico : Why do YOU think we need to raise the minimum wage?

It helps illegals.

Quote from TRNT : Do you really claim that a say 20% increase in min wage cause 20% inflation and 20% rise in poverty level. If not, then raising min wage indeed helps the min wage worker.

Deflecting with another question is still not an answer.