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popular Posted by BigShotBob • Sep 1, 2023
Sep 1, 2023 6:36 AM
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Item 1 of 2
popular Posted by BigShotBob • Sep 1, 2023
Sep 1, 2023 6:36 AM
Tesla Model X & Model S Price Cut
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Which typically costs a couple bucks a month and if you bought a 6-figure car, only put a tiny amount down, and didn't bother to get is kind of on you.
Meaning you end up in a better overall financial position than if your car was totaled and the price had NOT dropped significantly. I show the full math like five posts ago in this very thread.
Why would you buy a $110,000 car with so little down and NOT have gap insurance which costs pennies on the price?
Tesla consistently ranks at the top of the industry for owner satisfaction-- people are generally not satisifed if products have serious QC issues.
Most of the non-anecdotal evidence anyone can ever give here in the negative is stuff like Consumer Reports reader surveys where it's largely old people who still subscribe to a paper magazine being confused by a modern infotainment system--- not anything actually wrong with the reliability of the vehicle.
Of course, there are problems with panel gaps, trim falling off, etc, which doesn't usually happen with other manufacturers. Also, squeaks and creaks were common. I test drove a Model X a couple of days ago and there were a ton of squeaks and rattles in it. It was a 2022 Model X.
Look at the amount of recalls the 2023 Tesla Model Y has:
https://www.kbb.com/tesla/model-y...eid=466044
Also, the majority of people who purchase cars are not on forums unless they're either huge Tesla fans, or those who have major complaints about the car? I wouldn't use a forum to judge repeat ownership. On reddit, I've seen a lot of complaints about the car, and many people who are angry and will never buy a Tesla again because of their tanked values.
Also, there are tons of better quality EV's out there from Mercedes and BMW and can be leased for way less than the Model X. More and more manufacturers are now making EVs which are coming out in the next year or two.
The ONLY thing Tesla is good at, IMO, is their software integration. However, their quality seems to be lacking.
Actual real world fleet data shows you retain roughly 90% of your battery life in a Tesla after 200,000 miles.
Plus if you have an older S/X you've got 8 years unlimited miles of warranty on it anyway.
Double funny in that you JUST told us people ARE going to hang onto older ones longer, and now tell us....literally the opposite.
Which typically costs a couple bucks a month and if you bought a 6-figure car, only put a tiny amount down, and didn't bother to get is kind of on you.
Meaning you end up in a better overall financial position than if your car was totaled and the price had NOT dropped significantly. I show the full math like five posts ago in this very thread.
Also, don't forget, you still paid that $10k down, and whatever prices you paid for 6 months according to you. Getting into an accident after 6 months and having to pay $19k assuming $1500 monthly payments on a $110k vehicle is still 20% loss after just 6 months despite GAP insurance. Also, not everyone qualifies for tax credit. Many folks who can afford these vehicles DO NOT qualify, especially one that paid $110k for the vehicle in the first place.
So 20 would leave no hole at all to replace the car with a new one.
in fact you'd still be $7500 ahead since you now get a tax credit.
Tesla has had massively fewer recalls than Ford, GM, even Toyota, since they've been mass producing cars.
Further, most of the ones Tesla DOES have are just OTA software updates- not physical defects needing physical correction.
# of investigations that have ever found autopilot at fault for any accident or death:
Zero.
In contrast Toyota recalled every EV they ever made because the wheel wheels could fall off. And it took months for them to find a resolution.
Weird you'd single out Tesla here but think Toyota quality is great?
https://www.kbb.com/tesla/model-y...eid=466044
I ask because Ford, Chrysler, BMW, Nissan, Mercedes, Jaguar, and more have all had more recalls than Tesla this year. Just like the last 5 years where Tesla tends to have fewer recalls than even Toyota.
To provide specific #s-
From 6/28/2017 to today (roughly the period Tesla has been mass producing huge #s of cars with the Model 3 launch) Tesla has had 59 total recalls.
Toyota has had 289.
Ford has had 1437
GM has had 1626
and again a LARGE % of the few Tesla ones were resolved with an OTA software update- not a physical repair.
100% of the Toyota, Ford, and GM ones were physical repairs requiring a physical service tech to put hands on the car to repair it.
Tell me again how Tesla is the one with a quality problem
These "new, better, EVs" have been 1-2 years away for 10 years now
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25% of 80k (the current new price) is still 20k. In our example of someone paying 110k with 10k down originally the loan was only 100k.
So 20 would leave no hole at all to replace the car with a new one.
in fact you'd still be $7500 ahead since you now get a tax credit.
Luckily, my Mach E GT was MORE expensive because this happened in January right before the huge price drops from Ford, so I ended up making more than I paid for my car.
These "new, better, EVs" have been 1-2 years away for 10 years now
# of investigations that have ever found autopilot at fault for any accident or death:
Zero.
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023...autopilo
https://www.reuters.com/business/...023-08-24/
Honestly, you sound like a Tesla fan and Tesla can do no wrong, and all of your posts are heavily skewed towards Tesla. You keep mentioning the EV tax credit, but fail to understand many people who have disposable incomes to afford an $80k+ car exceed the income limits to meet the tax credit, especially the sky high interest rates currently.
However, I did put an order for the Model X, but at least I understand the limitations of Tesla having owned EV's in the past, and haven driven my dad's Tesla Model Y's everytime I come to visit. I did my research, and understand what owning a Tesla means, and the things I have to watch out for.
Allstate
Travelers
The Hartford
Liberty Mutual
Nationwide
Kemper
Progressive
Esurance
Some, like USAA also offer replacement assistance where they'll actually pay out 20% above ACV if the car is totaled.
Plus- of course- you can ALSO get it from your lender-- usually it's more expensive this way, but not much.
So again if you bought a 6-figure car without it, that's really on you.
If your car is old enough to be out of that range as I say you'd have paid roughly the same then as a new one.
That's true of any insurance.
If you picked bad coverage you're saving a few pennies and taking on extra risk. If that risk happens, that was due to your choice not to pay the pennies.
They sell in a year what Tesla sells a month or less.
These #s are even worse when looking at mainstream cars like the 3/Y versus the "competition" from folks like Ford or GM.
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023...autopilo
NHTSA opens investigations into stuff all the time. They are legally required to under a number of circumstances and typically open double-digit #s of them every quarter into all sorts of cars and companies.
NHTSA has found Tesla liable for any accident or death zero times ever
There is no reason at all to doubt they'll reach the same conclusion this time versus all the previous times.
here for example is their final report on the infamous 2016 crash where a Tesla, with the owner using autopilot in a situation you are explicitly not intended to use it, collided with a tractor trailer and was killed
https://static.nhtsa.go
the subject vehicles nor any incidents in which the systems did not perform as designed
The same report also notes they compared Tesla vehicle crash rates before and after Autopilot became an installed feature on the cars.
Post-AP crash rates dropped by 40% suggesting the system makes the car much safer overall.
Which is consistent with the safety figures Tesla has been publishing quarterly for years now- showing the accident rates on AP are much lower than the crash rates among Teslas not using it and the crash rates of all cars in general.
I notice BTW you ignored all the debunking of your recall claims and #s where I pointed out Tesla was among the least recalled car makers--- I wonder why?
Honestly, you sound like a Tesla fan and Tesla can do no wrong.
Cars crash all the time. It's rarely the car makers fault. Or in the case of Tesla so far, literally never.
Allstate
Travelers
The Hartford
Liberty Mutual
Nationwide
Kemper
Progressive
Esurance
Some, like USAA also offer replacement assistance where they'll actually pay out 20% above ACV if the car is totaled.
Plus- of course- you can ALSO get it from your lender-- usually it's more expensive this way, but not much.
So again if you bought a 6-figure car without it, that's really on you.
They sell in a year what Tesla sells a month or less.
These #s are even worse when looking at mainstream cars like the 3/Y versus the "competition" from folks like Ford or GM.
The only way to get them really cheap is to go through leasehackr.
Also when you say specs do you just mean HP and torque? It really depends on what the consumer wants. If they prioritize ride comfort and interior quality then Mercedes/BMW is on the top of their list. If they want supercharging then obviously Tesla is the only viable option for now. I'm only using my car as a commuter car locally and maybe some trips to the city about an hour away, so Tesla supercharging isn't important to me. I can charge my car at my own home much cheaper.
Even when the price of the X was much higher.
Why do you think that is if those BMW and Mercedes ones are actually competitive?
The Model X was priced VERY high in 2022 and somehow it was the only luxury full sized SUV to make the top 10 in EV sales in the US. Nothing at all from anyone else including BMW and Mercedes-
https://electrek.co/2023/01/09/th...s-of-2022/
(same is true of the Model S on the sedan side of EV sales- priced high yet #1 in sales in its class compared to BEVs from anyone else)
...and? As I mentioned there's still other options to obtain this kind of coverage, for cheap, even if you don't wish to change insurance companies.
It really depends on what the consumer wants. If they prioritize ride comfort and interior quality then Mercedes/BMW is on the top of their list. If they want supercharging then obviously Tesla is the only viable option for now. I'm only using my car as a commuter car locally and maybe some trips to the city about an hour away, so Tesla supercharging isn't important to me. I can charge my car at my own home much cheaper.[/QUOTE]
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yet another advantage to Teslas dealerless model
Sure. But still much higher than the comparable EV sales numbers from BMW or Mercedes.
Even when the price of the X was much higher.
Why do you think that is if those BMW and Mercedes ones are actually competitive?
Also range, ADAS tech, overall integration, cargo, towing, interior space, etc...
The Model X was priced VERY high in 2022 and somehow it was the only luxury full sized SUV to make the top 10 in EV sales in the US. Nothing at all from anyone else including BMW and Mercedes-
https://electrek.co/2023/01/09/th...s-of-2022/
(same is true of the Model S on the sedan side of EV sales- priced high yet #1 in sales in its class compared to BEVs from anyone else)
...and? As I mentioned there's still other options to obtain this kind of coverage, for cheap, even if you don't wish to change insurance companies.
It really depends on what the consumer wants. If they prioritize ride comfort and interior quality then Mercedes/BMW is on the top of their list. If they want supercharging then obviously Tesla is the only viable option for now. I'm only using my car as a commuter car locally and maybe some trips to the city about an hour away, so Tesla supercharging isn't important to me. I can charge my car at my own home much cheaper.
Why would GEICO be a weird Choice? You asked for a car insurance company that doesn't offer Gap insurance and was given the 2nd largest car insurer in the United States.
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