expired Posted by Cruiser272 • May 29, 2024
May 29, 2024 10:49 PM
Item 1 of 4
Item 1 of 4
expired Posted by Cruiser272 • May 29, 2024
May 29, 2024 10:49 PM
Refurb: Canon EOS R100 Camera w/ RF-S18-45mm f/4.5-6.3 IS STM Lens
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$479
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You can wrap the refurb camera in red roses or something instead.
I was beginning to fall into the "iPhone / Huawei phone/ Xiaomi phone as a camera replacement" line of thinking. Then I went to Taiwan and shot a whole bunch of pictures with my phones. When I returned I looked at them 65" large on a high resolution screen. And I was like, "wow, these look like absolute shit." I immediately started shopping for the latest mirrorless gear.
If you're looking at your pictures on an iPhone or Facebook you're probably going to be perfectly content. If you go larger, you may not be. You may find the fake bokeh that the iPhone makes quite satisfying. If you get into the habit of using high-quality prime lenses on good gear, you may start to find that fake bokeh unsatisfying and not as interesting as the results you get creating it optically. It may start to look fake and contrived to you, even in the places where the AI does a "good job" in a technical sense. At some point you may buy something like an 85mm f 1.4 lens and realize that no phone made now can really replicate its sensibility and aesthetic.
Snobbery abounds in the world of camera tech. My feeling is that people should use whatever makes them happy -- there is no "right" or "wrong." But there are definitely differences that are screamingly obvious once you're off of Facebook and away from small screens. Some people are willing to pay for those differences in weight and cost, and some are not. Up to you to decide what's right for you.
It feels like camera guys need good patience and profession. We tried so hard to watch YouTube videos and read books to use camera but the photo we took are simply far inferior than a raise and shot iPhone. (Occasionally we got one or two extremely good pictures from the RP though)Sometimes I really have to accept the reality that I'm not as good as algorithm in arts.
I wouldn't worry about it though. It packaged pretty nicely. This along with apple refurbished in my mind is equal to brand new. If somebody didn't see the refurbished label they for sure would think it's brand new.
You can wrap the refurb camera in red roses or something instead.
It feels like camera guys need good patience and profession. We tried so hard to watch YouTube videos and read books to use camera but the photo we took are simply far inferior than a raise and shot iPhone. (Occasionally we got one or two extremely good pictures from the RP though)Sometimes I really have to accept the reality that I'm not as good as algorithm in arts.
Do what you like, there's no need to chase any of this if you don't want to. Hunting and fishing may be your thing and I think that's great.
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It feels like camera guys need good patience and profession. We tried so hard to watch YouTube videos and read books to use camera but the photo we took are simply far inferior than a raise and shot iPhone. (Occasionally we got one or two extremely good pictures from the RP though)Sometimes I really have to accept the reality that I'm not as good as algorithm in arts.
The RP is full frame, but it's a still a few years older.
I have a Pixel 8 Pro with a 50 megapixel camera, double the 24 megapixel on the cropped frame R100 sensor. And my girlfriend has the newest iPhone.
For me, the R100 was noticeably better right from the start. Completely night and day. It blew the out phone cameras out of the water.
We walked around a lake town and took photos of the boats and buildings and mountains, and I was just snapping away withe the R100, not paying much attention, using autofocus for everything, and she was using her iPhone.
When we got home and looked at all our photos on my large high resolution screen, there was no question that the R100 were professional-level quality, while the iPhone photos looked kind of weird and unnatural sometimes, even though the AI correction is excellent.
When looking at photos on your phone screen, the iPhone photos look amazing of course, and with the AI and built in filters etc., they might look better than the raw R100 photos to some people.
But for high resolution printing, or viewing on larger high resolution screens, the in-focus details from the R100 really blew my mind and I was immediately sold. On a high resolution monitor, the iPhone and Pixel photos had some fuzziness or lack of clarity or just artifacts where you could see that AI smoothed it out.
I still love my camera phone but the R100 has really been amazing for me, a complete novice who just goes around snapping photos of people and things using the built in autofocus, and everyone loves them. I e taken headshots of lots of family members and friends and the bokeh and clarity you get from real lenses, even on this crop frame sensor with RF-S lenses, are just incredible compared to phone cameras. You can really make anyone look good in a headshot with even this lowest level Canon camera and lenses.
The RP is full frame, but it's a still a few years older.
I have a Pixel 8 Pro with a 50 megapixel camera, double the 24 megapixel on the cropped frame R100 sensor. And my girlfriend has the newest iPhone.
For me, the R100 was noticeably better right from the start. Completely night and day. It blew the out phone cameras out of the water.
We walked around a lake town and took photos of the boats and buildings and mountains, and I was just snapping away withe the R100, not paying much attention, using autofocus for everything, and she was using her iPhone.
When we got home and looked at all our photos on my large high resolution screen, there was no question that the R100 were professional-level quality, while the iPhone photos looked kind of weird and unnatural sometimes, even though the AI correction is excellent.
When looking at photos on your phone screen, the iPhone photos look amazing of course, and with the AI and built in filters etc., they might look better than the raw R100 photos to some people.
But for high resolution printing, or viewing on larger high resolution screens, the in-focus details from the R100 really blew my mind and I was immediately sold. On a high resolution monitor, the iPhone and Pixel photos had some fuzziness or lack of clarity or just artifacts where you could see that AI smoothed it out.
I still love my camera phone but the R100 has really been amazing for me, a complete novice who just goes around snapping photos of people and things using the built in autofocus, and everyone loves them. I e taken headshots of lots of family members and friends and the bokeh and clarity you get from real lenses, even on this crop frame sensor with RF-S lenses, are just incredible compared to phone cameras. You can really make anyone look good in a headshot with even this lowest level Canon camera and lenses.
I would be very, very surprised if there is any camera phone out there that could come close to the quality you can get with the $249 R100 equipped with the $99 RF50mm f 1.8 (turns into an 80mm-equivalent portrait lens on the APC sensor) or the ~$230mm RF16mm or the $275 35mm f1.8. In general these combos are going to absolutely destroy the camera phone in terms of quality, sharpness, resolution, actual detail, bokeh, actual color rendering, etc.
What camera phones do well is make computational choices that make some unusual shooting conditions look good. For example, they will tend to do very well in high contrast situations, and yield a "better" result than a "better" camera that is used in a naïve way.
I would be very, very surprised if there is any camera phone out there that could come close to the quality you can get with the $249 R100 equipped with the $99 RF50mm f 1.8 (turns into an 80mm-equivalent portrait lens on the APC sensor) or the ~$230mm RF16mm or the $275 35mm f1.8. In general these combos are going to absolutely destroy the camera phone in terms of quality, sharpness, resolution, actual detail, bokeh, actual color rendering, etc.
What camera phones do well is make computational choices that make some unusual shooting conditions look good. For example, they will tend to do very well in high contrast situations, and yield a "better" result than a "better" camera that is used in a naïve way.
On that note, zoom is a big difference in general. Looking at some of my Pixel 8 Pro photos where I zoomed in when taking the photo, it's basically game over there. Of course the zoom stinks on phones with the tiny camera/lens/sensor, compared to a real lens that has true optical zoom.
On the lake I took a photo of a house on the other side of the lake, a mile away, completely zoomed in with the RF-S 55-210 lens, and I was stunned at how clear the photo came out.
So I guess that's another big difference to point out. Casual party photos of people are going to look great when taken on your phone, but if you have to zoom at all, you immediately lose clarity and start to have more problems with stabilization etc.
Whereas even on the $250 R100 with a $99 55-210mm lens, you can zoom in to your heart's content and pretty much every single photo will still have amazing detail and focus.
I know the new Samsung phone can supposedly take great photos of the moon so maybe phones will even figure out how to match real lens quality through technology and continued miniaturization of components but for now I think these "real" cameras still win, even the cheapest one on this deal.
https://www.kenrockwell
I really like his perspective on everything -- he's an expert but he doesn't disrespect the lower-end/cheap models like this R100.
He basically says that because it's such a new model, it benefits from all the new technology and features of the new / higher-end Canon RF and RF-S models that cost $2,000 or more, and basically the R100 still has around 95% of those features and still takes excellent photos to the extent where most non-experts really could not even notice any difference.
I also followed his advice about not lugging around a big backpack full of equipment. I just bought a small cheap black bag that I sometimes use, and sometimes I just bring the camera and the one 18-150mm lens, to minimize weight and time/frustration lost to changing lenses etc.
And so far it's been a great experience for me. I literally haven't used any of the advanced features whatsoever. I used the built-in automatic focus / stabilization all the time, just point and shoot, and I use the physical zoom wheel on the lens for zooming/framing depending on the shot.
So everyone is different and I completely respect anyone who has the money or knowledge to go for a higher end camera and lenses.
I'm obviously the exact target market for this R100 camera and so far it's been perfect for me, especially since I didn't know whether it would just sit on the shelf after the first week like the darn DJI mini 2 drone that I bought last year.
Having said that, now that I've been getting into it for the last few months, I already want to buy a higher-end full-frame camera. Some day!
1) The bodies actually are not that much lighter than full-frame gear if you're buying serious cameras
2) Very good on the long end: lenses are small and sharp with exceptional reach compared to FF gear
3) Micro Four Thirds falls apart in low light, at least at the time I bought it. This will improve but the fact remains that a smaller sensor implicitly cannot do more than a larger one, at least for now
4) Crappy battery life
Item #3 was a deal-killer for me. I kept all of my expensive micro 4/3rds lenses, thinking that in time sensors will improve to the point the deficiencies won't matter so much. But it didn't suit my shooting habits. I would look very carefully at this if I were buying again, many reviews gloss over this issue.
I was actually looking at the new MF3 Olympus OM1 before I decided the right path was to buy up a bunch of mirrorless camera gear, and have the option of using my old Canon EF lenses with adapters. Some of the EF lenses I have, such as the Sigma "Art" lenses, are exquisite.
My advice for you is check out the state of current sensor tech, and pay attention to the low light issue. A MF3 image that you can make look "acceptable" with a lot of monkeying in Lightroom isn't nearly as good as something that comes out of your camera with acceptable quality and with no tweaks. Consider what exactly MF3 is going to get you that this $299 or $399 gear will not. There's something to be said for "cheap." I am skeptical you can get comparable MF3 gear at anywhere near this price point. I could be wrong. Please tell us if you find anything!
Some quick thoughts on your conclusions:
1) Absolutely agreed. But in this case, at the much lower, nonserious end, the size and weight difference is not insignificant. https://camerasize.com/compact/#9...0.409,ha,f
2) Agreed again, love being able to casually shoot birds off hand (in the sunlight lol, #3 is true af) with a lens that's routinely on sale around $300-$400.
3) Yeah, it's not great. I would lightly argue it might be a bit overblown for the average person. That being said, I've gotten some good shots on my current kit, but I reach for the Dxo Photolab Denoise AI more than I'd like.
4) I haven't experienced the battery life problem, but I don't do this professionally so perhaps I haven't put it through enough stress. I think I get around 300 shots per battery (or ~ 2.5 hours of on time) which I'm good with for them being several years old at this point.
As for things you can get around this price, there's some used/refurb Oly PEN EPL9 with the 14-42 kit pancake for $400. Also some EPL7 and EPL8 for $250-$350 with either the kit pancake or that and the "plastic fantastic" 40-150mm. I can grab some links if anyone is interested at all, but they're pretty easy to find.
All that being said, I'm in the unique position of already having some MF3 lenses. Maybe an EPL8 with a 14-42 and a 40-150 is comparable to this R100. Maybe it's not. I think the size is a pretty big deal when the most important camera is the one you have with you. The MF3 camera is significantly smaller. I don't know enough about the R100, but how is the stabilization compared to the IBIS on MF3 (usually good for a few stops)?
I haven't experienced much FF photography. Went from an APS-C Pentax system to the MF3 system which absolutely was the right call for me *then*. But a lot has changed in photography in the decade or so since I made that change, so I appreciate your insight on this.
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