46% of Americans believe human beings were created in their present form within the past 10,000 years

Quote from EscapeVelo : I accept that Christian mythology is what it is. These stories are the basis of Christian metaphysics and worldview of humanity and how they relate to the cosmos. Adam and Eve represent the Male and Female of humanity.

I am curious....is there a calculus based version of metaphysics just like there is a calculus based version of physics?

HarHarHar

Quote from darkfrog : (removing to keep post short)

DF, I'd assume you know I'm not a pure creationist.

There is a great deal of evidence to suggest what you say, sure. Then again, there are lots of oddities that point things in the other direction:

DNA similarities are further away than scientists originally estimated
Archaic neanderthal remains are in Europe/Russia while modern human remains are in Africa
You can use a pig heart in a human - this really blows my mind
etc

Thus, following the scientific method, sure it's a reasonable conclusion to conclude we came from chimpanzees.

Quote from bridgeburner : http://humanorigins.si.edu/evidence/genetics For the very same reason that we can do paternity tests to prove that family members are related, we can show quite clearly that we are very closely related to primates.

Read a lot of the link and was expecting to learn something new (nothing really new for me there).

The relation is still largely based on looks, bone structure, etc. The DNA similarities were more distant than scientists originally expected after discovering good usable remains in the late 1990s. Also the geography gap still poses a paradox.

Thanks for the link.

Quote from mohater : DF, I'd assume you know I'm not a pure creationist. There is a great deal of evidence to suggest what you say, sure. Then again, there are lots of oddities that point things in the other direction: DNA similarities are further away than scientists originally estimated Archaic neanderthal remains are in Europe/Russia while modern human remains are in Africa You can use a pig heart in a human - this really blows my mind etc Thus, following the scientific method, sure it's a reasonable conclusion to conclude we came from chimpanzees.

So you are conceding that there is sufficient scientific evidence for common ancestry and your comment, "man evolved from monkeys is neither testable nor repeatable." is wrong?

Quote from mohater : DF, I'd assume you know I'm not a pure creationist.

Never claimed you were but you did criticize common ancestry.

Quote : There is a great deal of evidence to suggest what you say, sure. Then again, there are lots of oddities that point things in the other direction:

Not really. Of course there is no one 'other' direction, there are millions of them.

Quote : DNA similarities are further away than scientists originally estimated

What do you mean by further away? Estimates of relatedness change as new studies are done and we get more and more accurate. Early claims were most likely very rough estimates but it nothing has changed in determining that chimpanzees are our closest non-human relative.

Quote : Archaic neanderthal remains are in Europe/Russia while modern human remains are in Africa

Relevance? Neanderthal is not a direct ancestor of modern humans, they evolved on a separate branch.

Quote : You can use a pig heart in a human - this really blows my mind etc

Again relevance? I can use chicken embryos to make vaccines.
I can use cows to make a football. Using a pig heart certainly means that pigs have some relation to humans but I bet a chimp heart would work even better.

Quote from charles052 : I'm saying that Denis Leary isn't funny. Then again, neither was Bill HIcks.

Ignorance without the bliss :-)

Quote from mohater : Read a lot of the link and was expecting to learn something new (nothing really new for me there). The relation is still largely based on looks, bone structure, etc. The DNA similarities were more distant than scientists originally expected after discovering good usable remains in the late 1990s. Also the geography gap still poses a paradox. Thanks for the link.

It's not just dna of fossils. It's dna comparing all living species of the present day. IE.. we know for a fact that human's an chimpanzee's had a common ancestor more recently than human's and gorilla's (based on the similarities in our dna).


What geography gap?

Quote from charles052 : I'm saying that Denis Leary isn't funny. Then again, neither was Bill HIcks.

Hicks was an awesome comedian.

I'm sure we can all agree that our science education is in the dumps thanks to MTV in recent years.

Quote from darkfrog : Never claimed you were but you did criticize common ancestry. Not really. Of course there is no one 'other' direction, there are millions of them.

Sure, I didn't intend to mean it's binary.

Quote from darkfrog : What do you mean by further away? Estimates of relatedness change as new studies are done and we get more and more accurate. Early claims were most likely very rough estimates but it nothing has changed in determining that chimpanzees are our closest non-human relative.

Sure, I'm just saying that a lot of the attributes we thought were accurate are more and more becoming detached. We don't have tails, we don't kill all the young when we become the leader of a group, etc.

Quote from darkfrog : Relevance? Neanderthal is not a direct ancestor of modern humans, they evolved on a separate branch.

See above.

Quote from darkfrog : Again relevance? I can use chicken embryos to make vaccines. I can use cows to make a football. Using a pig heart certainly means that pigs have some relation to humans but I bet a chimp heart would work even better.

While we are very similar to chimps, we're also very different. Some primates are carries of HIV, but are largely immune to it and it blows us away. Add to that we're using pig parts to repair human hearts.

Look, we agree on many points. All I'm saying is it's post modern Christianity that decided to say "the earth is 10,000 years old" and "God planted the dinosaur bones there" Religion is silent on the majority of these things.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1...r_embedded