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I have a surface pro 6 + pen as well as an M1 ipad pro and pencil. I actually prefer the surface for my music notes and leave that in my studio. The iPad is better for media, but there's a strong use case for a sp 4,5,6 in 2024. My wife is still using her sp4 in the same capacity.
Considering Microsoft moving to ARM based laptops which come off as the closest to even match Apple ARM based laptops, I'm afraid if I'd be getting my hands on tech that I know is gonna become obsolete in a short time.
Otherwise it seems to be a fantastic piece of tech boasting specs at this price, I'd love to jump on. Thoughts?
Also, I wonder why they skimp on laptop webcams. Would it cost so much more to add a 1080p webcam to a top-spec laptop? Cheapo phones come with at least 1080p front facing camera and 2-4 rear cameras. Why's it so hard to do that in a laptop? #rant
Microsoft has actually been on ARM for a while (see SQ1, 2, 3), it's just that the arm cpus have finally approached and compete with AMD/Intel, and Mac M1-3 series type power
Surfaces generally have their own sort of niche so I'd consider buying if you are interested. The new ones are going to be much more expensive, and even several year old surfaces retain some value to resell on ebay
Windows won't be fully transitioning the arm for a long time, if ever .
Apple has complete control over their ecosystem, they basically just decided X86 was obsolete and decided to transition arm. They aren't really designing new Intel computers anymore. Microsoft doesn't have that control, OEMs will continue making X86 laptops for the foreseeable future .
I can't imagine arm windows becoming the norm within the next 5 years.
I actually was going to go with an arm laptop, but Microsoft isn't even trying to get things compatible. Case and point, they haven't even tried to put out arm versions of the games they publish.
You're kind of right and wrong.
Arm doesn't even need to be the "norm" to be viable, they simply need enough raw power to be able to handle apps through emulators.
Apple got an early start using emulators in their OS ever since the power pc to Intel transition in the early 2000s. They had non Intel, RISC (similar architecture to smartphones) cpus from 1991 up to as recent as 2005 (ie two years before the iPhone), and shifted back to RISC (M1, etc) recently. But they've always done extensive software support for old hardware, so they had to keep effective emulators in the os for Intel cpus to keep the os ecosystem in tact. They have decades of experience integrating emulators inside the OS.
Microsoft has only started the attempt recently; they used to reserve unique crippled os versions for arm cpus (windows RT). Arm cpus have been capable of emulating non native applications since Microsoft added support (within the past couple years), it's just that the cpus didn't have a lot of processing power to start with (see SQ1, SQ2, SQ3, and x64 emulation).
There's other discounts on surface refurbs as well. I ordered the Surface Pro 5 (i5, 8g ram, 256 G ssd) - $209 and the Surface Pen- $18
Then ordered keyboard folio for $40 and cover case for $10.
Not too shabby. Going to be using it for videos, reading sheet music off it, Possibly even running reaper on it with my MAudio interface for some recording using Neural DSP Archetype GOJIRA. We'll see how well that holds up.
Could you please inform where did you buy the pen, keyboard and case. Thanks 👍
Considering Microsoft moving to ARM based laptops which come off as the closest to even match Apple ARM based laptops, I'm afraid if I'd be getting my hands on tech that I know is gonna become obsolete in a short time.
Otherwise it seems to be a fantastic piece of tech boasting specs at this price, I'd love to jump on. Thoughts?
Also, I wonder why they skimp on laptop webcams. Would it cost so much more to add a 1080p webcam to a top-spec laptop? Cheapo phones come with at least 1080p front facing camera and 2-4 rear cameras. Why's it so hard to do that in a laptop? #rant
Microsoft is not Apple. They will not screw over their customer base.
X86 Windows is not going away.
Horrible laptop. I have this exact spec for work. Battery lasts 1 hour. When docked it runs SO HOT. 119F case temperature. Fans at 100% even idling on the desktop. It gets so hot and thermal throttles so hard that Teams calls turn into a slideshow.
I spent literally 15+ hours trying to make it not horrible - and I work in IT. (Firmware, software, cpu frequency limiting, I even took it apart and repasted it.). This is the single worst laptop I have ever used. It REQUIRES a cooling pad to use when docked -- all of the coworkers I've asked have the exact same experience and opinion of this particular Surface.
The i5 runs marginally cooler and gets slightly better battery life.
In general, Surface devices last 2-3 years, so a used one is nearly dead. Buy an Elitebook used for the same price and it will last 7-10 years. Source: I have managed IT environments with hundreds of laptops.
Last edited by spiffytexan June 24, 2024 at 07:09 PM.
Tempting, but I think I'll keep on the hunt for an XPS 13 with the 11th gen i7/16GB ram. I've seen them go for $350 on bids.
I have an 11th gen XPS13 with a high rez OLED display. Got it 18 months ago for $800. Had the motherboard replaced just after the warranty expired as it crapped out and just had to reimage windows due to continuous BSOD issues. I love the feel and format... it feels premium and maybe I have a lemon but it is not reliable.
Horrible laptop. I have this exact spec for work. Battery lasts 1 hour. When docked it runs SO HOT. 119F case temperature. Fans at 100% even idling on the desktop. It gets so hot and thermal throttles so hard that Teams calls turn into a slideshow.
I spent literally 15+ hours trying to make it not horrible - and I work in IT. (Firmware, software, cpu frequency limiting, I even took it apart and repasted it.). This is the single worst laptop I have ever used. It REQUIRES a cooling pad to use when docked -- all of the coworkers I've asked have the exact same experience and opinion of this particular Surface.
The i5 runs marginally cooler and gets slightly better battery life.
In general, Surface devices last 2-3 years, so a used one is nearly dead. Buy an Elitebook used for the same price and it will last 7-10 years. Source: I have managed IT environments with hundreds of laptops.
Something is wrong with your laptop.
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Otherwise it seems to be a fantastic piece of tech boasting specs at this price, I'd love to jump on. Thoughts?
Also, I wonder why they skimp on laptop webcams. Would it cost so much more to add a 1080p webcam to a top-spec laptop? Cheapo phones come with at least 1080p front facing camera and 2-4 rear cameras. Why's it so hard to do that in a laptop? #rant
Surfaces generally have their own sort of niche so I'd consider buying if you are interested. The new ones are going to be much more expensive, and even several year old surfaces retain some value to resell on ebay
Apple has complete control over their ecosystem, they basically just decided X86 was obsolete and decided to transition arm. They aren't really designing new Intel computers anymore. Microsoft doesn't have that control, OEMs will continue making X86 laptops for the foreseeable future .
I can't imagine arm windows becoming the norm within the next 5 years.
I actually was going to go with an arm laptop, but Microsoft isn't even trying to get things compatible. Case and point, they haven't even tried to put out arm versions of the games they publish.
Arm doesn't even need to be the "norm" to be viable, they simply need enough raw power to be able to handle apps through emulators.
Apple got an early start using emulators in their OS ever since the power pc to Intel transition in the early 2000s. They had non Intel, RISC (similar architecture to smartphones) cpus from 1991 up to as recent as 2005 (ie two years before the iPhone), and shifted back to RISC (M1, etc) recently. But they've always done extensive software support for old hardware, so they had to keep effective emulators in the os for Intel cpus to keep the os ecosystem in tact. They have decades of experience integrating emulators inside the OS.
Microsoft has only started the attempt recently; they used to reserve unique crippled os versions for arm cpus (windows RT). Arm cpus have been capable of emulating non native applications since Microsoft added support (within the past couple years), it's just that the cpus didn't have a lot of processing power to start with (see SQ1, SQ2, SQ3, and x64 emulation).
Then ordered keyboard folio for $40 and cover case for $10.
Not too shabby. Going to be using it for videos, reading sheet music off it, Possibly even running reaper on it with my MAudio interface for some recording using Neural DSP Archetype GOJIRA. We'll see how well that holds up.
All of them are yet to arrive so I'll update this answer with the links once they come and I can confirm they work and are of decent quality.
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Otherwise it seems to be a fantastic piece of tech boasting specs at this price, I'd love to jump on. Thoughts?
Also, I wonder why they skimp on laptop webcams. Would it cost so much more to add a 1080p webcam to a top-spec laptop? Cheapo phones come with at least 1080p front facing camera and 2-4 rear cameras. Why's it so hard to do that in a laptop? #rant
X86 Windows is not going away.
I spent literally 15+ hours trying to make it not horrible - and I work in IT. (Firmware, software, cpu frequency limiting, I even took it apart and repasted it.). This is the single worst laptop I have ever used. It REQUIRES a cooling pad to use when docked -- all of the coworkers I've asked have the exact same experience and opinion of this particular Surface.
The i5 runs marginally cooler and gets slightly better battery life.
In general, Surface devices last 2-3 years, so a used one is nearly dead. Buy an Elitebook used for the same price and it will last 7-10 years. Source: I have managed IT environments with hundreds of laptops.
I spent literally 15+ hours trying to make it not horrible - and I work in IT. (Firmware, software, cpu frequency limiting, I even took it apart and repasted it.). This is the single worst laptop I have ever used. It REQUIRES a cooling pad to use when docked -- all of the coworkers I've asked have the exact same experience and opinion of this particular Surface.
The i5 runs marginally cooler and gets slightly better battery life.
In general, Surface devices last 2-3 years, so a used one is nearly dead. Buy an Elitebook used for the same price and it will last 7-10 years. Source: I have managed IT environments with hundreds of laptops.
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