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[S]United[/S] States of America

5,807 2,347 November 14, 2012 at 01:22 PM in Chat (3) Youtube
[I want to preface this by saying this is not meant to be a thread throwing blame at one side or the other...there's an entire different section for that. This is just to get people's feedback on recent news....]

Never thought I'd use the words secession and viral in the same sentence, but that seems to be the trend on Facebook and Twitter over the last few days. It seems as though the government has received petition requests from at least 40 states (different articles report different stats) and over 700,000 people and steadily rising.

I'm just happy to see that people are finally making the progression from backroom murmur and rumblings to now be willing to sternly voice their displeasure with our current system. I don't know that a secession will actually happen, but I do believe that this is a step in the right direction for the people to pave their own futures.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/polit...icks-fast/
http://www.wbtv.com/story/2007555...signatures
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nh...r_embedded

It's actually hard to find results from the larger known media outlets as they don't even seem to be reporting on it.
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Joined Nov 2003
The original gay....
> bubble2 8,038 Posts
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HeyLookItsMe
11-14-2012 at 04:26 PM.
11-14-2012 at 04:26 PM.
Quote from AngryPirate :
I don't think that (most) people actively seek to deny facts. I think "facts" flung down from the top are purposely convoluted to the point that no one really knows what the facts are. When the media outlets are owned by the same people that do business with our politicians, it's near impossible to drudge through the sea of bias to find out what the real facts are.

I agree with the sentiment of the last paragraph, but government has shown repeatedly that they do not have the people's best interest in mind...hence why many people are looking for ways to sever their ties to this system in one manner or another.
so nationalizing health insurance isn't in the interest of the people? protecting the alaskan wilderness isn t in th einterest of the people? regulating pollution isn't in the interest of the people? ensuring women's right to vote isn't in the interest of the people?
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Joined Aug 2005
Baldilocks
> bubble2 41,173 Posts
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emelvee
11-14-2012 at 04:52 PM.
11-14-2012 at 04:52 PM.
Quote from HeyLookItsMe :
so nationalizing health insurance isn't in the interest of the people? protecting the alaskan wilderness isn t in th einterest of the people? regulating pollution isn't in the interest of the people? ensuring women's right to vote isn't in the interest of the people?
Providing housing/jobs/cars/food to everyone is "in the interest of the people". It does mean it's the federal government's job to do these things. The federal government should do those things that states can't do (such as defending from foreign enemies) or are otherwise enumerated in the Constitution. Why can't states that want to institute health care like Massachusetts? If they do and I want that, I can move there and still have the basic rights granted to me as a citizen. If I don't want that level of government, I can choose to live in a different state, and still have those rights.
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-14-2012 at 05:04 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:04 PM.
Quote from emelvee :
Providing housing/jobs/cars/food to everyone is "in the interest of the people". It does mean it's the federal government's job to do these things. The federal government should do those things that states can't do (such as defending from foreign enemies) or are otherwise enumerated in the Constitution. Why can't states that want to institute health care like Massachusetts? If they do and I want that, I can move there and still have the basic rights granted to me as a citizen. If I don't want that level of government, I can choose to live in a different state, and still have those rights.
wow....I'm not sure if I've ever seen such a serious reply from you....though I'm still checking feverishly with my special pun magnifying glass. Smilie
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Joined Aug 2005
Baldilocks
> bubble2 41,173 Posts
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emelvee
11-14-2012 at 05:15 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:15 PM.
Quote from AngryPirate :
wow....I'm not sure if I've ever seen such a serious reply from you....though I'm still checking feverishly with my special pun magnifying glass. Smilie
Sorry for throwing you for a loop. laugh out loud
This is one area I take very seriously...there aren't many. laugh out loud
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Baldilocks
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emelvee
11-14-2012 at 05:19 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:19 PM.
Quote from HeyLookItsMe :
The problem is that people want to deny facts. Even if they are right that global warming is made up we should change what we are doing because we are killing the planet
The world stopped getting warmer almost 16 years ago. [dailymail.co.uk]

Don't know how valid the article is about global warming...didn't read it. Just trying to stir the pot. Big Grin
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-14-2012 at 05:23 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:23 PM.
Quote from emelvee :
The world stopped getting warmer almost 16 years ago. [dailymail.co.uk]

Don't know how valid the article is about global warming...didn't read it. Just trying to stir the pot. Big Grin
My understanding of it is that the earth naturally goes through periods of heating and cooling, and that even though our carbon footprint may play some role in it, the impact is minimal. Again though, not stating any of this as fact... this is just my understanding based on things I've read.

Quote from emelvee :
Sorry for throwing you for a loop. laugh out loud
This is one area I take very seriously...there aren't many. laugh out loud
I see that. It's actually refreshing to see this other side of you with strong opinions on things.
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Last edited by AngryPirate November 14, 2012 at 05:24 PM.
Joined Aug 2005
Baldilocks
> bubble2 41,173 Posts
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emelvee
11-14-2012 at 05:26 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:26 PM.
Quote from AngryPirate :
My understanding of it is that the earth naturally goes through periods of heating and cooling, and that even though our carbon footprint may play some role in it, the impact is minimal. Again though, not stating any of this as fact... this is just my understanding based on things I've read.
I always laugh when people talk about "climate" meaning a few years, or decades, or centuries, etc. You can't call it a trend if it takes place over, say, 100 years...you need to look at more like 10,000 or 100,000 year cycles.

That being said, there is a ton of damage that humans have caused, and that's sad...deforestation, pollution, etc.

Quote from AngryPirate :
I see that. It's actually refreshing to see this other side of you with strong opinions on things.
I'd enjoy some discussions like this in the Podium if it weren't for the lunatics. I have nothing against lunatics in general (proven by the amount of time I spend in the Lounge)...just not the type that spends so much time in TP. laugh out loud
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Last edited by emelvee November 14, 2012 at 05:27 PM.

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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-14-2012 at 05:36 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:36 PM.
Quote from emelvee :
I always laugh when people talk about "climate" meaning a few years, or decades, or centuries, etc. You can't call it a trend if it takes place over, say, 100 years...you need to look at more like 10,000 or 100,000 year cycles.

That being said, there is a ton of damage that humans have caused, and that's sad...deforestation, pollution, etc.


I'd enjoy some discussions like this in the Podium if it weren't for the lunatics. I have nothing against lunatics in general (proven by the amount of time I spend in the Lounge)...just not the type that spends so much time in TP. laugh out loud
Oh yeah..I know we've had a huge impact on the Earth in other aspects...I was just referring to the global warming impact.

And I agree about TP. Anyone can see from my history of posts that I much enjoy a (respectable) back and forth, and welcome differing opinions. However, I just can't stand the silly games that TP plays with the close-minded, one sided agendas. It's impossible to have a reasonable/respectful debate.
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Joined Nov 2003
The original gay....
> bubble2 8,038 Posts
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HeyLookItsMe
11-14-2012 at 05:39 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:39 PM.
Quote from emelvee :
Providing housing/jobs/cars/food to everyone is "in the interest of the people". It does mean it's the federal government's job to do these things. The federal government should do those things that states can't do (such as defending from foreign enemies) or are otherwise enumerated in the Constitution. Why can't states that want to institute health care like Massachusetts? If they do and I want that, I can move there and still have the basic rights granted to me as a citizen. If I don't want that level of government, I can choose to live in a different state, and still have those rights.
the moving there argument is stupid IMHO…. its not that easy to just pick up your entire life and move
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Joined Aug 2005
Baldilocks
> bubble2 41,173 Posts
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emelvee
11-14-2012 at 05:41 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:41 PM.
Quote from HeyLookItsMe :
the moving there argument is stupid IMHO…. its not that easy to just pick up your entire life and move
Huh

I've lived in 6 different states. 1 for the first 18 years of my life, 5 others as an adult over the past 29. 2 different (on each coast) since I've had a family.
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Joined Nov 2003
The original gay....
> bubble2 8,038 Posts
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HeyLookItsMe
11-14-2012 at 05:43 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:43 PM.
Quote from emelvee :
I always laugh when people talk about "climate" meaning a few years, or decades, or centuries, etc. You can't call it a trend if it takes place over, say, 100 years...you need to look at more like 10,000 or 100,000 year cycles.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SP7x11-PHcI
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Joined Oct 2007
Wants a Quiche
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Justawannabe
11-14-2012 at 05:45 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:45 PM.
Quote from HeyLookItsMe :
the moving there argument is stupid IMHO…. its not that easy to just pick up your entire life and move
It is if it is that imporant to you.. Pilgrims!!
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-14-2012 at 05:46 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:46 PM.
Quote from HeyLookItsMe :
so nationalizing health insurance isn't in the interest of the people? protecting the alaskan wilderness isn t in th einterest of the people? regulating pollution isn't in the interest of the people? ensuring women's right to vote isn't in the interest of the people?
I've not said that the government has never done anything good. However, I will reply with NDAA, DHS, CISPA, SOPA, Patriot Act, etc. Google any of these and ask yourself if rights aren't being hindered. Also, you can browse through this as well...
http://www.nyclu.org/pdfs/eroding_liberty.pdf
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Joined Nov 2003
The original gay....
> bubble2 8,038 Posts
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HeyLookItsMe
11-14-2012 at 05:49 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:49 PM.
Quote from AngryPirate :
I've not said that the government has never done anything good. However, I will reply with NDAA, DHS, CISPA, SOPA, Patriot Act, etc. Google any of these and ask yourself if rights aren't being hindered. Also, you can browse through this as well...
http://www.nyclu.org/pdfs/eroding_liberty.pdf
but most of these are because people are trying to EXPLOIT as apposed to work together
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-14-2012 at 05:53 PM.
11-14-2012 at 05:53 PM.
Quote from HeyLookItsMe :
but most of these are because people are trying to EXPLOIT as apposed to work together
it's the same government coming up with these things as the ones you mentioned.
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