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[S]United[/S] States of America

5,807 2,347 November 14, 2012 at 01:22 PM in Chat (3) Youtube
[I want to preface this by saying this is not meant to be a thread throwing blame at one side or the other...there's an entire different section for that. This is just to get people's feedback on recent news....]

Never thought I'd use the words secession and viral in the same sentence, but that seems to be the trend on Facebook and Twitter over the last few days. It seems as though the government has received petition requests from at least 40 states (different articles report different stats) and over 700,000 people and steadily rising.

I'm just happy to see that people are finally making the progression from backroom murmur and rumblings to now be willing to sternly voice their displeasure with our current system. I don't know that a secession will actually happen, but I do believe that this is a step in the right direction for the people to pave their own futures.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/polit...icks-fast/
http://www.wbtv.com/story/2007555...signatures
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nh...r_embedded

It's actually hard to find results from the larger known media outlets as they don't even seem to be reporting on it.
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Joined Feb 2010
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> bubble2 4,199 Posts
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idkist
11-15-2012 at 06:30 AM.
11-15-2012 at 06:30 AM.
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Joined Jun 2004
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> bubble2 31,118 Posts
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vec
11-15-2012 at 06:32 AM.
11-15-2012 at 06:32 AM.
Quote from idkMyBFFist :
Crylol
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Joined Oct 2007
Wants a Quiche
> bubble2 2,486 Posts
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Justawannabe
11-15-2012 at 06:40 AM.
11-15-2012 at 06:40 AM.
Quote from idkMyBFFist :
Dam you beat me to it...laugh out loud
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Joined Jun 2005
Live Like No One Else
> bubble2 8,512 Posts
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stealth
11-15-2012 at 06:45 AM.
11-15-2012 at 06:45 AM.
Quote from emelvee :


Popcorn
laugh out loud
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Joined Mar 2009
Schrödinger's Frog
> bubble2 19,435 Posts
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Frogstar
11-15-2012 at 06:57 AM.
11-15-2012 at 06:57 AM.
Quote from vec :
I'm just now seeing this thread and didn't read through it in it's entirety so I apologize for not know which side of the discussion you are on.

The only thing that I am curious about is the money aspect, especially for states that may have low or no income taxes.

In the extremely unlikely scenario of secession:
  • How are all the lost federal dollars being replaced? Do they think that 1 state could sustain itself?
  • Since the US military will be "taking their ball and going home" and leave Texas with nothing, What is their military going to be comprised of and how will it be financed?
  • On the same military topic, since the US borders will now retract to the new US border location, what will stop Mexico from coming in and taking over? Will they they ask for help from the United States?

I'm sure I could think of other questions but it's early in the day Smilie Also, once again, I'm not sure where you stand with your opinion. Just wanted to ask a few questions.
The Texas petition claims they have the 15th largest economy in the world.
I'm sure the Mexican cartels would love nothing more than for this to actually happen laugh out loud
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-15-2012 at 07:01 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:01 AM.
Quote from bridgeburner :
Obama is in a tricky position. For one thing, he didn't create this deficit. Obama's policies are only responsible for 8% of the deficit. At the moment, he's basically faced with the choice of shrinking the deficit, or boosting the economy. He can't really do both. Either he raises taxes and cuts entitlements (which will shrink the deficit but hurt the economy) or he leaves taxes alone and lets the economy recover while letting the deficit grow. It's not an easy decision.
Your opinion is more than welcome, but as mentioned in the first post, I'd prefer it didn't turn into a typical Podium thread where blame is thrown back and forth. Plenty of threads over in TP for that.

And to reply to your first post, it has already been mentioned a few times by a few people that secession is probably not the real motive, but rather sending a large, loud message to government (and not just one party in particular) that people are fed up with the current system.
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vec
11-15-2012 at 07:02 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:02 AM.
Quote from Frogstar :
The Texas petition claims they have the 15th largest economy in the world.
It's not as large as they might think. Once they start taxing the hell out of everything companies will start outsourcing to the United States. laugh out loud
Quote from Frogstar :
I'm sure the Mexican cartels would love nothing more than for this to actually happen laugh out loud
That was my first thought. laugh out loud
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-15-2012 at 07:09 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:09 AM.
Quote from Princess Crunch :
For shitz and giggles click here [whitehouse.gov]. You will see how silly some of these people are. They also forget that most sites log your IP address. If Obama wanted to be an asshole he could get them for treason.
Our Constitution defines "treason" as an act of war against the US. A peaceful request can in no way be constituted as an act of war.

Quote :
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.
Quote from vec :
I'm just now seeing this thread and didn't read through it in it's entirety so I apologize for not know which side of the discussion you are on.

The only thing that I am curious about is the money aspect, especially for states that may have low or no income taxes.

In the extremely unlikely scenario of secession:
  • How are all the lost federal dollars being replaced? Do they think that 1 state could sustain itself?
  • Since the US military will be "taking their ball and going home" and leave Texas with nothing, What is their military going to be comprised of and how will it be financed?
  • On the same military topic, since the US borders will now retract to the new US border location, what will stop Mexico from coming in and taking over? Will they they ask for help from the United States?

I'm sure I could think of other questions but it's early in the day Smilie Also, once again, I'm not sure where you stand with your opinion. Just wanted to ask a few questions.
No problem...reading page 4 and 5 should give you a clear view of my stance.
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Last edited by AngryPirate November 15, 2012 at 07:11 AM.
Joined Jun 2004
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vec
11-15-2012 at 07:14 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:14 AM.
Quote from AngryPirate :
No problem...reading page 4 and 5 should give you a clear view of my stance.
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Joined Aug 2005
Baldilocks
> bubble2 41,173 Posts
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emelvee
11-15-2012 at 07:18 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:18 AM.
Quote from AngryPirate :
No problem...reading page 4 and 5 should give you a clear view of my stance.
This thread is only on page 3 for me.
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Joined Jun 2004
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vec
11-15-2012 at 07:21 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:21 AM.
Quote from emelvee :
This thread is only on page 3 for me.
Maybe he's posting from the future. I guess we will have to wait a day or two to get a clear view of his stance laugh out loud
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Joined Oct 2007
Get over it
> bubble2 5,807 Posts
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Original Poster
AngryPirate
11-15-2012 at 07:38 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:38 AM.
Quote from vec :
Quote from emelvee :
This thread is only on page 3 for me.
bah...~10 posts per page...don't like scrolling.


Quote from vec :
Maybe he's posting from the future. I guess we will have to wait a day or two to get a clear view of his stance laugh out loud
I am...and I'm happy to report that we've finally tracked down an ED pill that won't counteract the Rogaine.
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Joined Nov 2003
The original gay....
> bubble2 8,038 Posts
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HeyLookItsMe
11-15-2012 at 07:56 AM.
11-15-2012 at 07:56 AM.
Quote from arjunsr :
president bush won with less of the electoral college, and i think less of a margin in the popular vote than president obama. there's been a lot of right wing overreaction, ie the run on ammunition after president obama was elected. it never manifested and a lot of right wings paid a lot more than needed over irrational fears.

i'd be glad to vote for a republican who's a moderate and true the original party ideal of less government, fiscal conservatism.
But you forget gun sellers and manufacturers create this hype every time a democratic elected or a mass tragedy occurs because it gives them business and then the news media eats he hype and creates more. It's free advertising
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Joined Nov 2003
The original gay....
> bubble2 8,038 Posts
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HeyLookItsMe
11-15-2012 at 08:04 AM.
11-15-2012 at 08:04 AM.
Quote from bridgeburner :
Obama is in a tricky position. For one thing, he didn't create this deficit. Obama's policies are only responsible for 8% of the deficit. At the moment, he's basically faced with the choice of shrinking the deficit, or boosting the economy. He can't really do both. Either he raises taxes and cuts entitlements (which will shrink the deficit but hurt the economy) or he leaves taxes alone and lets the economy recover while letting the deficit grow. It's not an easy decision.
Or if you live in the real world you would know that he is actually doing both. The economy is slowly but surely recovering and he has already cut the deficit

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news...r-low?lite

http://bobcesca.com/blog-archives...obama.html


Quote :
When Obama took office, the economy was shrinking at roughly 8% annually. For most of Obama's term, it's been growing, as the chart below shows. In absolute terms, the economy is now $853 billion larger than it was before Obama was inaugurated. So, yes, we're better off.

But if you're a little disappointed, you're not alone.

Coming out of the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression, ending a 20-year dependence on credit-fueled growth and in the wake of a delayed response to the crisis by the administration of then-President George W. Bush, the recovery was always going to be fitful. So it's no surprise that, 18 quarters after the pre-recession peak in GDP activity, the economy has managed to grow only 1.8% over the pre-recession high.
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Freak On A Leash
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Princess Crunch
11-15-2012 at 08:08 AM.
11-15-2012 at 08:08 AM.
Quote from Landers :
Exactly what about those petitions is equal to: "The betrayal of one's own country by waging war against it or by consciously or purposely acting to aid its enemies"?
Quote from AngryPirate :
Our Constitution defines "treason" as an act of war against the US. A peaceful request can in no way be constituted as an act of war.
As soon as these nut jobs find out that their request will not be peacefully granted it will either go 1) They cower back to their corner or 2) Start using those guns they so adamantly started buying.

I'm sure most of it is just idol talk but some of these people have already said they want to start a civil war over this. Starting a war or turning your back on your own country is treason. Starting a Petition to secede is most certainty treason because they are turning their back on their country.
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