Model: eufy RoboVac LR20 Robot Vacuum, Laser Navigation for effortlessly precise cleaning, 3000Pa Superior Suction Power, EufyHome App
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I think one needs to be a total idiot to think that anything on the internet is private. Just about every single big organization has had data leaks and hacks . . . do people not learn anything at all.
The rule is very simple, if you value privacy simply do not invite camera or microphone in that location. If you are are going to invite that and expect security and privacy, the joke is on you.
I use different brands of cameras all around the house, cost is great and I get notifications promptly. But if one want's to watch me mow my grass or watch my packages delivered I would not care, because the moment I installed the cameras is the moment I gave up the privacy right to that area.
As for the camera on the vacuum, the brand is totally irrelevant to me. If the technology requires a a video and a connection to the internet . . . I will mitigate that 2 ways:
Not use it
Use it at night when I am not in that area with a kill switch to vac/router
No way I'm using anything form Eufy after the latest news on Eufy/Anker's awful privacy practices. And I believe these Eufy Robo vacs have a camera on them as well.
This guy Paul Moore figured it out. All credit to him.
as i have stated, it is irrelevant about what you have to say about security, who is and who is not, who wants and who does not care, who to blame or who not to blame . . . and all the other noise and disillusion you want to focus on, at the end: if you want privacy = you don't install camera or microphone in the area.
Cool story bro.
You started by comparing selling a living thing to selling a product. Then deflected on that ridiculous comparison by flashing your credentials. Now you're arguing something else.
You're telling us that anything transmitted on the internet is hackable leaving your privacy vulnerable… omg, mind blown, tell me more mr government contractor!
Stop and read the the other peoples messages. They are told the data resides locally and not transmitted.. that's the issue.
I have an iPhone and dont use icloud for storage/backup/etc. my expectations have been set that my photos won't leave my device unless I choose to. If I find out apple is backing up to the cloud anyway, that's a problem.
I guess I'm an idiot for accepting that I gave up my privacy whenever I take pics or record videos. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You started by comparing selling a living thing to selling a product. Then deflected on that ridiculous comparison by flashing your credentials. Now you're arguing something else.
You're telling us that anything transmitted on the internet is hackable leaving your privacy vulnerable… omg, mind blown, tell me more mr government contractor!
Stop and read the the other peoples messages. They are told the data resides locally and not transmitted.. that's the issue.
I have an iPhone and dont use icloud for storage/backup/etc. my expectations have been set that my photos won't leave my device unless I choose to. If I find out apple is backing up to the cloud anyway, that's a problem.
I guess I'm an idiot for accepting that I gave up my privacy whenever I take pics or record videos. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
you are an idiot if you believe that a device connected to the internet is private. and yes, that includes your phone and it's content. (on top of that a phone can be lost: Cellebrite[wikipedia.org], Grayshift . . .)
to me it's irrelevant who promised what, what happened and how. knowing the REALITY will help you make wise decisions before things go wrong, or alternatively you could point a finger after the fact as your bedroom video is circulating all over the internet.
I think one needs to be a total idiot to think that anything on the internet is private. Just about every single big organization has had data leaks and hacks . . . do people not learn anything at all.
That is exactly the point though. They claimed that your data WAS NOT stored on the internet, but rather only on your local hardware, when that was a complete lie. People purchased this product specifically because of this heavily advertised claim.
I would also point out that professional security researchers don't have the kind of Twitter feed this guy does. Finds a flaw, exposes it without following industry standard notification timeline, and then takes glee as customers abandon the vendor.
That's because this wasn't your standard security incident where a researcher finds a vulnerability that the organization was not aware of and can take the chance to fix it. This company was not only unbelievably ignorant (authentication not necessary to access data, data sent either unencrypted or "encrypted" with the key in plain text), but I'd argue actively malicious with the misleading marketing and especially the facial ID tagging that is consistent across devices that aren't directly connected together.
This these being the case, even if he did take the time to follow the "industry standard notification timeline", a company exhibiting such behavior would either 1) not do anything, or 2) say they fixed it when in reality all they did is hide their malicious intent (ex: they say they're going to encrypt the data now, which of course should be good, but it also means now we won't be able to see under the hood like this anymore to expose them).
That's because this wasn't your standard security incident where a researcher finds a vulnerability that the organization was not aware of and can take the chance to fix it. This company was not only unbelievably ignorant (authentication not necessary to access data, data sent either unencrypted or "encrypted" with the key in plain text), but I'd argue actively malicious with the misleading marketing and especially the facial ID tagging that is consistent across devices that aren't directly connected together.
This these being the case, even if he did take the time to follow the "industry standard notification timeline", a company exhibiting such behavior would either 1) not do anything, or 2) say they fixed it when in reality all they did is hide their malicious intent (ex: they say they're going to encrypt the data now, which of course should be good, but it also means now we won't be able to see under the hood like this anymore to expose them).
That still doesn't change best practice. Best practice is to notify the company and give them time to respond because it protects the security of everyone else while the company gets a chance to remediate the issue. Even if they created the flaw without basic care and attention to security practices, they still need time in private to fix it lest everyone get hacked while they spend time fixing things.
Secondly I would also note that the reproducibility of this one is questionable. If it was as the researcher described then we shouldn't have any issue and yet it's not reliably reproduced. I'm not trying to excuse Eufy's practices, but they seem sadly all too common in the industry. I've grown up in computer security as a software engineer and even Eufy's practices here are relatively mildly off of typical care and attention for the industry. Threatening to abandon ship for another manufacturer would be like threatening to leave Wells Fargo for Chase. It's silly.
Better deal? This, the G32 for $88 or the roborock Q5 for $299?
At some point (ideally point #1) you have to look at the features and decide which vac suits your needs the best then go looking for a deal - not the other way around. If it doesn't work for you it doesn't matter that is was cheap, and vice versa.
Looking at the 1000's of reviews on Amazon for the Eufy G30 (G32 equivalent) and the LR35 (LR20 equivalent) models you'll see that the overall scores are pretty similar despite the price difference. That's not to say that the G30 is as good as the LR35, it's just that customers were overall equally satisfied with the performance of the model they bought for the price they paid.
At some point (ideally point #1) you have to look at the features and decide which vac suits your needs the best then go looking for a deal - not the other way around. If it doesn't work for you it doesn't matter that is was cheap, and vice versa.
Looking at the 1000's of reviews on Amazon for the Eufy G30 (G32 equivalent) and the LR35 (LR20 equivalent) models you'll see that the overall scores are pretty similar despite the price difference. That's not to say that the G30 is as good as the LR35, it's just that customers were overall equally satisfied with the performance of the model they bought for the price they paid.
Well, this one and the roborock Q5 seem very similar, but people rave about roborocks. So it makes me unsure.
I've never owned a robovac, so all I have to go by is my understanding of the differences between lidar and non-lidar systems from the internet.
I have two levels, 1400 sq. feet, cats, almost all carpets, and a long-haired wife.
Well, this one and the roborock Q5 seem very similar, but people rave about roborocks. So it makes me unsure.
The Q5 has auto-emptying support which is a big difference. That's one reason you'd be paying more for it. Does auto-emptying matter to you?
Looking at the reviews on Amazon for the Q5 it appears that people rate it higher overall than either Eufy. If money was no option I'd go for the Q5. If my needs were simple and I had limited budget I'd go for the G30/32. I'm not sure I'd even consider the LR20/35, but that's just me.
BTW I have tried cheap robovacs in the past and was not impressed. Navigation is a crapshoot and they generally don't handle transitions (hard floor to mat to rug) well, but I'm always willing to try anew every few years in case things have improved.
That is exactly the point though. They claimed that your data WAS NOT stored on the internet, but rather only on your local hardware, when that was a complete lie. People purchased this product specifically because of this heavily advertised claim.
they are many parts to this that we simply do not know, and maybe will find out as time progresses. what we do know is that all the problems that eufy had, has always been in regions, this last issue was not replaceable across same device all over the world. This tells me that each region is not setup identically and could be managed independently, could be a toggle that was not reset after testing. the source code could give us more information too. so, are they responsible for dropping the ball on this one, yes. will they fix the issue after the fact, i am sure they will. will you be able to get your data back, no.
it is funny how some folks react "i will sell all my eufy stuff today" "i am going to spend more money on something else" " . . . .". this panic reaction only tells me that they have placed their cameras in locations that compromises them and now they realize that they have made a foolish mistake. i see people placing their cameras inside the house, kids bedrooms . . . i just don't understand the stupidity. these are same people we will be posting nonsense and trying a class-action . . . lol
my point is very simple, do not invite the camera where it does not belong in the first place, it's not a matter of how or who, it's a matter of when.
The Q5 has auto-emptying support which is a big difference. That's one reason you'd be paying more for it. Does auto-emptying matter to you?
Looking at the reviews on Amazon for the Q5 it appears that people rate it higher overall than either Eufy. If money was no option I'd go for the Q5. If my needs were simple and I had limited budget I'd go for the G30/32. I'm not sure I'd even consider the LR20/35, but that's just me.
BTW I have tried cheap robovacs in the past and was not impressed. Navigation is a crapshoot and they generally don't handle transitions (hard floor to mat to rug) well, but I'm always willing to try anew every few years in case things have improved.
Thanks. 👍 I just picked up the G32 that I ordered the other day. I really want the Q5, and I would love to have auto empty, but when I showed my wife the price of a roborock, she thought I was crazy. I'll try this $88 G32 out and see if she likes these things first before I splurge on a roborock. You did talk me out of this deal, and I think it was for the best. Thanks again.
you are an idiot if you believe that a device connected to the internet is private. and yes, that includes your phone and it's content. (on top of that a phone can be lost: Cellebrite[wikipedia.org], Grayshift . . .)
to me it's irrelevant who promised what, what happened and how. knowing the REALITY will help you make wise decisions before things go wrong, or alternatively you could point a finger after the fact as your bedroom video is circulating all over the internet.
If I'm and idiot, then I'm not sure what you are! Your first analogy is comparing selling a dog to selling a product and now you talk about losing your phone. What in the world does that have to do with cyber security?
You say it's irrelevant who promised what and that's the crux of the problem you don't seem to get. Consumers have a right to be upset if they are told nothing leaves the device only to find out it does.
If I sold a car and advertised it's top speed at 200mph and you bought it only to find out it tops out at 150mph and I knew this… In your view it sounds like you have no right to be upset and are the fool for believing my claims.
At anycase, we'll agree to disagree and leave it there.
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The rule is very simple, if you value privacy simply do not invite camera or microphone in that location. If you are are going to invite that and expect security and privacy, the joke is on you.
I use different brands of cameras all around the house, cost is great and I get notifications promptly. But if one want's to watch me mow my grass or watch my packages delivered I would not care, because the moment I installed the cameras is the moment I gave up the privacy right to that area.
As for the camera on the vacuum, the brand is totally irrelevant to me. If the technology requires a a video and a connection to the internet . . . I will mitigate that 2 ways:
Not use it
Use it at night when I am not in that area with a kill switch to vac/router
This guy Paul Moore figured it out. All credit to him.
https://youtu.be/qOjiCbxP5Lc
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here are just some facts that make your point moot:
https://www.csoonline.c
https://www.securitymag
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/3...reach.html
https://www.theguardian
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56141093
as i have stated, it is irrelevant about what you have to say about security, who is and who is not, who wants and who does not care, who to blame or who not to blame . . . and all the other noise and disillusion you want to focus on, at the end: if you want privacy = you don't install camera or microphone in the area.
Cool story bro.
You started by comparing selling a living thing to selling a product. Then deflected on that ridiculous comparison by flashing your credentials. Now you're arguing something else.
You're telling us that anything transmitted on the internet is hackable leaving your privacy vulnerable… omg, mind blown, tell me more mr government contractor!
Stop and read the the other peoples messages. They are told the data resides locally and not transmitted.. that's the issue.
I have an iPhone and dont use icloud for storage/backup/etc. my expectations have been set that my photos won't leave my device unless I choose to. If I find out apple is backing up to the cloud anyway, that's a problem.
I guess I'm an idiot for accepting that I gave up my privacy whenever I take pics or record videos. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You started by comparing selling a living thing to selling a product. Then deflected on that ridiculous comparison by flashing your credentials. Now you're arguing something else.
You're telling us that anything transmitted on the internet is hackable leaving your privacy vulnerable… omg, mind blown, tell me more mr government contractor!
Stop and read the the other peoples messages. They are told the data resides locally and not transmitted.. that's the issue.
I have an iPhone and dont use icloud for storage/backup/etc. my expectations have been set that my photos won't leave my device unless I choose to. If I find out apple is backing up to the cloud anyway, that's a problem.
I guess I'm an idiot for accepting that I gave up my privacy whenever I take pics or record videos. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
to me it's irrelevant who promised what, what happened and how. knowing the REALITY will help you make wise decisions before things go wrong, or alternatively you could point a finger after the fact as your bedroom video is circulating all over the internet.
This these being the case, even if he did take the time to follow the "industry standard notification timeline", a company exhibiting such behavior would either 1) not do anything, or 2) say they fixed it when in reality all they did is hide their malicious intent (ex: they say they're going to encrypt the data now, which of course should be good, but it also means now we won't be able to see under the hood like this anymore to expose them).
This these being the case, even if he did take the time to follow the "industry standard notification timeline", a company exhibiting such behavior would either 1) not do anything, or 2) say they fixed it when in reality all they did is hide their malicious intent (ex: they say they're going to encrypt the data now, which of course should be good, but it also means now we won't be able to see under the hood like this anymore to expose them).
Secondly I would also note that the reproducibility of this one is questionable. If it was as the researcher described then we shouldn't have any issue and yet it's not reliably reproduced. I'm not trying to excuse Eufy's practices, but they seem sadly all too common in the industry. I've grown up in computer security as a software engineer and even Eufy's practices here are relatively mildly off of typical care and attention for the industry. Threatening to abandon ship for another manufacturer would be like threatening to leave Wells Fargo for Chase. It's silly.
Sign up for a Slickdeals account to remove this ad.
Looking at the 1000's of reviews on Amazon for the Eufy G30 (G32 equivalent) and the LR35 (LR20 equivalent) models you'll see that the overall scores are pretty similar despite the price difference. That's not to say that the G30 is as good as the LR35, it's just that customers were overall equally satisfied with the performance of the model they bought for the price they paid.
Looking at the 1000's of reviews on Amazon for the Eufy G30 (G32 equivalent) and the LR35 (LR20 equivalent) models you'll see that the overall scores are pretty similar despite the price difference. That's not to say that the G30 is as good as the LR35, it's just that customers were overall equally satisfied with the performance of the model they bought for the price they paid.
Well, this one and the roborock Q5 seem very similar, but people rave about roborocks. So it makes me unsure.
I've never owned a robovac, so all I have to go by is my understanding of the differences between lidar and non-lidar systems from the internet.
I have two levels, 1400 sq. feet, cats, almost all carpets, and a long-haired wife.
Looking at the reviews on Amazon for the Q5 it appears that people rate it higher overall than either Eufy. If money was no option I'd go for the Q5. If my needs were simple and I had limited budget I'd go for the G30/32. I'm not sure I'd even consider the LR20/35, but that's just me.
BTW I have tried cheap robovacs in the past and was not impressed. Navigation is a crapshoot and they generally don't handle transitions (hard floor to mat to rug) well, but I'm always willing to try anew every few years in case things have improved.
it is funny how some folks react "i will sell all my eufy stuff today" "i am going to spend more money on something else" " . . . .". this panic reaction only tells me that they have placed their cameras in locations that compromises them and now they realize that they have made a foolish mistake. i see people placing their cameras inside the house, kids bedrooms . . . i just don't understand the stupidity. these are same people we will be posting nonsense and trying a class-action . . . lol
my point is very simple, do not invite the camera where it does not belong in the first place, it's not a matter of how or who, it's a matter of when.
Looking at the reviews on Amazon for the Q5 it appears that people rate it higher overall than either Eufy. If money was no option I'd go for the Q5. If my needs were simple and I had limited budget I'd go for the G30/32. I'm not sure I'd even consider the LR20/35, but that's just me.
BTW I have tried cheap robovacs in the past and was not impressed. Navigation is a crapshoot and they generally don't handle transitions (hard floor to mat to rug) well, but I'm always willing to try anew every few years in case things have improved.
Thanks. 👍 I just picked up the G32 that I ordered the other day. I really want the Q5, and I would love to have auto empty, but when I showed my wife the price of a roborock, she thought I was crazy. I'll try this $88 G32 out and see if she likes these things first before I splurge on a roborock. You did talk me out of this deal, and I think it was for the best. Thanks again.
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to me it's irrelevant who promised what, what happened and how. knowing the REALITY will help you make wise decisions before things go wrong, or alternatively you could point a finger after the fact as your bedroom video is circulating all over the internet.
If I'm and idiot, then I'm not sure what you are! Your first analogy is comparing selling a dog to selling a product and now you talk about losing your phone. What in the world does that have to do with cyber security?
You say it's irrelevant who promised what and that's the crux of the problem you don't seem to get. Consumers have a right to be upset if they are told nothing leaves the device only to find out it does.
If I sold a car and advertised it's top speed at 200mph and you bought it only to find out it tops out at 150mph and I knew this… In your view it sounds like you have no right to be upset and are the fool for believing my claims.
At anycase, we'll agree to disagree and leave it there.