Detailed Answer:
Step 1: Look at Line 11 on your 2022 Tax return (Form 1040).
Step 1a: For the vast majority of taxpayers this won't apply: Add to Step 1 any income from Puerto Rico you excluded, any housing exclusion foreign income you claimed (Lines 45 and 50 of Form 2555), and American Samoa residential income excluded (Line 15 of Form 4563).
Step 2: If that number is less than:
$300,000 Married Filing Jointly
$225,000 Head of Household
$150,000 Single and any other filing status
then continue to Step 3. Otherwise, you currently DO NOT qualify for any rebate, and will need to reduce that number on your 2023 Tax return below those limits. You can reduce that number by traditional 401k contributions, or some small-business options.
Step 3: Look at Line 24 on your 2022 Tax return (Form 1040).
- If it is greater than $7,500 and your income in 2023 stays the same or increase, you will get the full $7,500.
- If it is less than that, you get that amount (assuming your income stays the same). If your income increases then you may get a larger refund, up to $7,500.
In other words, in order to get the full tax credit, you must OWE at least $7500 in taxes and be under the income limits.
You absolutely CAN NOT carry over for a few years, or even one more year. It is a one time credit. Any unused credit is LOST!
Q7. Is the new clean vehicle credit refundable or able to be carried forward? (updated March 31, 2023)
A7. The new clean vehicle credit may only be claimed to the extent of reported tax due of the taxpayer and cannot be refunded. The new clean vehicle credit cannot be carried forward to the extent it is claimed for personal use on Form 1040, Schedule 3, Additional Credits and Payments.
from page 3 of this IRS document: https://www.irs.gov/pub/taxpros/fs-2023-08.pdf
* If you're concerned about battery degradation, you can take a look at this site [teslalogger.de] (Pull down the menu for Model Y LR)
* If you like to nerd out on graphs, data, and overal health of your vehicle, get a program called teslamate that can be installed on your home server. every time your car parks in your garage it will send driving telemetry data to it with pretty graphs [teslamate.org] and all.
* You can also opt to get teslausb [github.com], which can wirelessly send all your dashcam footage to your home server every time you pull into your garage.
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EV good if you have a dedicated charging station at home.
if you live in an apartment complex or condo its not as consumer friendly, unless you want to pay up the wazoo at supercharger stations and inconvenience yourself by having to go there every time to charge. Go to plugshare.com to see how much you will be paying in your area. Just multiply cents * 45kwh (assuming you're charging from 20% to 80%). For my area I would be paying $20-$25 per charge at a supercharger station. At home, with the national average electrity rate of 0.14 / kwh, it would cost $6
if you live in california, don't forget that you can also get another $2k in CVRP rebate. you get a check in the mail but the wait time is long to get it.
also don't forget about the single occupant HOV lane decal you can sign up at the DMV website.
basic autopilot is more than sufficient. autopilot still has a long ways to go imo. definitely not worth getting the advanced AP and definitely not full self driving at $15k. as MKBHD always says, don't buy a product on a promise of features yet to come.
also, make sure you setup your electricity usage to "time of use" or EV-specific plan as your bill will assuredly go up. Don't be on those tiered plans. Yes, you will end up saving money compared to ICE vehicles paying for gas, unless you get a hybrid, which is a bit more comparable, especially in areas where electricity is expensive.
additionally, people forget that you need to install a wall connector or mobile connector in your home. equipment costs $230 for the mobile connector +$45 for the nema 14-50 adapter, which is good enough especially if you do scheduled charging at night to save on electricity. installation itself will vary depending on your region and how much electricians will charge you, but it can get expensive. just make sure you're not getting ripped off as electricians are aware of the EV craze and asking for higher premiums on them. installation can go anywhere from $1k-$2k+. (according to poster SamirPD, you can ask the electrictian to install a dryer outlet and it should save you money and prevent you from being ripped off). One worthy note, EV charger and installation is tax deductible at 30%, just need to fill out the tax form [irs.gov] when you do your taxes next year. EDIT: SD poster hiro916 indicated that the 30% tax deduction only pertains to low income or rural tract areas, so YMMV [reddit.com].
as for car insurance, I'm paying $95 a month through Geico, but thats with a robust policy.
if you are impatient like me, and want to get one right away without having to wait, go to the waitingfortesla discord server [discord.com] and setup alerts for any time a Model Y drops in your local area. You have to act quick as they get snatched up relatively quickly. You can see whats in inventory on their website too [waitingfortesla.com]. Don't expect to see base model Y LR coming into inventory. If you want to pick something up quick settle for the 20 inch induction wheels (costs $2k extra) as they are more readily available. You can always sell the tires if you want to recoup some of the costs and get an aftermarket hubcap that look better than stock anyhow.
If you're interested in a real world range comparison of current popular EV's check out this YT video [youtube.com].
once you pick up your car you have 100 miles and 7 days to report any defects. panels gaps aren't as much of a problem anymore compared to years past, but be on the lookout for them. paint quality isn't so great out of the factory, mine came with swirl marks all over and had to get it paint corrected.
if you're concerned about battery degradation, you can take a look at this site [teslalogger.de] (select dropdown and look for Y LR AWD US to see the average degradation over time based on mileage. on average after 50k miles you should see about a 10% degradation, and it will degrade more slowly 50k+ miles onwards.
in terms of accessories, the only real requirement imo that you need are mud flaps. reason being is because without them, the rear passenger quarter panels will get hit with rock chips very quickly. tesmanian is a good aftermarket seller, or you can just opt for ones you see on amazon. if you want to go deeper into accessories temu is a great site for low prices compared to amazon.
if you like to nerd out on graphs, data, and overal health of your vehicle, get a program called teslamate that can be installed on your home server. every time your car parks in your garage it will send driving telemetry data to it with pretty graphs [teslamate.org] and all.
you can also opt to get teslausb [github.com], which can wirelessly send all your dashcam footage to your home server every time you pull into your garage.
my personal thoughts on ownership thus far. overall i like it. i am using it as a daily driver / commuter car. i don't think of Model Y and 3 as a 'luxury' vehicle. I see Tesla as a software company trying to be an automaker, and the legacy automakers are trying to be more like Tesla by being more tech focused. Teslas are continuously getting software updates to improve year over year. Interior build quality is spartan, and the ride quality need some improvement, especially if you are in an area with poor road conditions. if you're really into tech like me, this is the car for you. Performance vehicles I still prefer ICE cars over EV's however. first thing you will notice in an EV though, is the instant torque. that is what will grab you immediately.
If you have questions and need instant feedback join the Tesla discord, I'm active on there and other members can assist with questions you may have: https://discord.com/invite/tesla
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Still have my eGolf and love it. I have ~30k miles and the brakes are like new because of regenerative braking. I could sell it today at a profit as well. Would buy another EV but not from Elon Musk.
For example, with:
49,990 base price
+1,000 paint
+ 6,000 enhanced autopilot
I'm at $56,990. However, I still get the message that "Your design qualifies for a $7,500 federal tax credit for eligible buyers." Is that true? Do the add-ons not contribute to the MSRP?
I believe I found the answer to my own question:
The vehicle price at time of delivery must not exceed the following caps. This price includes optional equipment physically attached to the vehicle at the time of delivery and excludes software features, accessories, taxes and fees.
And, just to add to the ridiculousness of this... when electricity fails, do you know what else fails? Gas pumps! Right? So how stupid is it to tell people they shouldn't buy electric cars... because electricity can suffer a blackout? Maybe we should all live in caves and heat our homes with wood fires.
I remember days where you could only get gas on even or odd numbered license plate days, and super long lines at gas stations. I pay over $4.50 for premium gas these days. I don't own an electric vehicle but I'm going to respond when someone posts something that's absolutely ridiculous. If you want to learn more, watch this video: https://youtu.be/7dfyG6FXsUU
When there's a Slickdeal on an air conditioner, do you tell people they should only buy gas-powered air conditioners? What about hot tubs? Should people only buy gas powered hot tubs?
The vehicle price at time of delivery must not exceed the following caps. This price includes optional equipment physically attached to the vehicle at the time of delivery and excludes software features, accessories, taxes and fees.
I can't understand why Tesla hasn't tweaked the body designs if they're looking to move more units. The two Tesla owners I know (both happy, both with loans paid off, one with a 3, one with an S) tell me they won't consider making a move (and making payments) untilTesla releases updated models. My two friends can't be the only Tesla owners in this situation.
Yea IRS just changed rule recently so all Ys have 80k ceiling now, basically all Ys qualify
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Edit: Something has changed
And, just to add to the ridiculousness of this... when electricity fails, do you know what else fails? Gas pumps!
I remember days where you could only get gas on even or odd numbered license plate days, and super long lines at gas stations. I pay over $4.50 for premium gas these days. I don't own an electric vehicle but I'm going to respond when someone posts something that's absolutely ridiculous. If you want to learn more, watch this video: https://youtu.be/7dfyG6FXsUU
When there's a Slickdeal on an air conditioner, do you tell people they should only buy gas-powered air conditioners? What about hot tubs? Should people only buy gas powered hot tubs?
Ugh the old "gas pumps run on electricity" snipe. No shit. There are these things called...... generators...... that run on gas...... that gas stations tend to have plenty of.
When we lose power here, provided it's not some temporary thing, e.g. someone runs into a telephone pole, then it tends to be for long periods of time (week+) and wide-ranging (whole state). I've *never* had an issue getting gas during those times (plus I can store gas ahead of time, basically as much as I want, in fact at any time I have about 40 gals on hand), but the few charging spots we have don't have power. If you have an EV, unless you want to plug it into a 240V generator, you're basically screwed. You'd better hope you don't have to drive anywhere significantly, before the power comes back on. In my ~ 50 mile commute, I basically wouldn't be able to make that commute without buying a generator specifically to charge the EV, which is utterly moronic.
"I remember when you could only get gas depending on license plate.....". I also remember paying $1.20 for gas less than 3 years ago, and my electricity just keeps increasing because we don't build power plants in this country. The price I pay for electricity literally increased by 50% in January. Gas has never done that (and worse, gas goes up and gas goes down, electricity tends not to do that).
And you're being hyperbolic with the "gas powered hot tub" comments.
Your video? I like that guy's videos but there's a lot of wink and nodding going on.
Can the Electric Grid Handle EV Charging? [ucsusa.org]
The grid is well-equipped to supply energy to EVs at current adoption levels.
"there is currently enough power generation and transmission currently to serve the increase in charging load from EV purchases in the next few years"
See the language? "current adoption levels" either means "current number of EVs" or "current rate at which EVs are being purchased". The government clearly wants to accelerate that. And, "currently enough power generation" doesn't mention price. There's always power just like there's always gasoline. However, if demand increases without supply, price will increase. There goes the "EVs are cheaper to drive" argument, which is failing even now.
- new design will require new manufacturing process.
- new design will require more time to settle down and more fit and finish issue for the fist year or so.
- new design will require new trainings of assemble workers.
- new design will certainly needs tens if not hundreds of engineering headcount-year.
All this will eat through the profit margin.
VW made only slight cosmetic changes to the Beetle in the 50s, 60s, and 70s - the taillights for example.
A cosmetic change by Tesla to the shape of taillights and headlights would likely motivate some vain 5+ year Tesla drivers to finslly upgrade. There's no way this would add more than $100 per unit.
Right now gas is $3.28 (just filled this AM) and I pay $0.36/kwh. If a random EV is getting 4 miles/kwh, in order for the ICE to meet that pricepoint it only has to hit 36mpg. Any comparably-sized new ICE can get that in a heartbeat.
"But what about maintenance"? That's a secondary consideration. The EV will be much more than the ICE on initial cost, the ICE will cost more in maintenance but not that much. EV's go through tires at a quicker rate than ICE. ICE is basically only going to require oil changes, and in the longer term perhaps coolant and transmission fluid changes. These are peanuts compared with the increased capital cost of the EV, and given the very low per-mile difference in cost of the EV vs ICE (even if there is one), makes the breakeven period very long, like 100k+ long or more, and that's assuming that absolutely *nothing* goes wrong on the EV, as in ZERO maintenance, which we all know won't be true.
I'll concede though, if you get cheap power that's going to be a primary driver in making the EV economics work. I wouldn't rest on my laurels though.
According to the US EPA, only Hawaii has electric rates of 30 cents per kWh: 30.31 cents. You claim that you're paying more than the most expensive state in the US. In all other states, electricity costs between 8 cents and 20 cents per kWh.
https://www.eia.gov/electricity/state/
Do you live in Hawaii? Well if you did, then you'd know that gas prices there are not $3.28 a gallon, they're also sky-high, at $4.78 a gallon [aaa.com]. In fact, only in Mississippi and Alabama is gasoline selling at $3.28 a gallon, on average, right now. So you came up with the lowest gas prices in America and compared it against the highest electric prices in America. Yes, these are averages, but you oddly live in what is likely the only place in America with record-high electricity and record-low gas. Really?
If a car gets 4 miles per kWh, with 20 cent electricity, that's 20 miles for a dollar. My Prius can't even get the 60 MPG needed to equal that!
Again, I don't own an electric car. But facts are facts and I think you are being dishonest.
The grid is well-equipped to supply energy to EVs at current adoption levels.
"there is currently enough power generation and transmission currently to serve the increase in charging load from EV purchases in the next few years"
See the language? "current adoption levels" either means "current number of EVs" or "current rate at which EVs are being purchased". The government clearly wants to accelerate that. And, "currently enough power generation" doesn't mention price. There's always power just like there's always gasoline. However, if demand increases without supply, price will increase. There goes the "EVs are cheaper to drive" argument, which is failing even now.
The grid has grown in capacity. It will continue to grow in capacity. As he said, EV's pull about as much power as an air conditioner or hot tub, and who's screaming that people shouldn't buy AC's?
EV good if you have a dedicated charging station at home.
if you live in an apartment complex or condo its not as consumer friendly, unless you want to pay up the wazoo at supercharger stations and inconvenience yourself by having to go there every time to charge. Go to plugshare.com to see how much you will be paying in your area. Just multiply cents * 45kwh (assuming you're charging from 20% to 80%). For my area I would be paying $20-$25 per charge at a supercharger station. At home, with the national average electrity rate of 0.14 / kwh, it would cost $6
if you live in california, don't forget that you can also get another $2k in CVRP rebate. you get a check in the mail but the wait time is long to get it.
also don't forget about the single occupant HOV lane decal you can sign up at the DMV website.
basic autopilot is more than sufficient. autopilot still has a long ways to go imo. definitely not worth getting the advanced AP and definitely not full self driving at $15k. as MKBHD always says, don't buy a product on a promise of features yet to come.
also, make sure you setup your electricity usage to "time of use" or EV-specific plan as your bill will assuredly go up. Don't be on those tiered plans. Yes, you will end up saving money compared to ICE vehicles paying for gas, unless you get a hybrid, which is a bit more comparable, especially in areas where electricity is expensive.
additionally, people forget that you need to install a wall connector or mobile connector in your home. equipment costs $230 for the mobile connector +$45 for the nema 14-50 adapter, which is good enough especially if you do scheduled charging at night to save on electricity. installation itself will vary depending on your region and how much electricians will charge you, but it can get expensive. just make sure you're not getting ripped off as electricians are aware of the EV craze and asking for higher premiums on them. installation can go anywhere from $1k-$2k+. One worthy note, EV charger and installation is tax deductible at 30%, just need to fill out the tax form [irs.gov] when you do your taxes next year
as for car insurance, I'm paying $95 a month through Geico, but thats with a robust policy.
if you are impatient like me, and want to get one right away without having to wait, go to the waitingfortesla discord server [discord.com] and setup alerts for any time a Model Y drops in your local area. You have to act quick as they get snatched up relatively quickly. You can see whats in inventory on their website too [waitingfortesla.com]. Don't expect to see base model Y LR coming into inventory. If you want to pick something up quick settle for the 20 inch induction wheels (costs $2k extra) as they are more readily available. You can always sell the tires if you want to recoup some of the costs and get an aftermarket hubcap that look better than stock anyhow.
If you're interested in a real world range comparison of current popular EV's check out this YT video [youtube.com].
once you pick up your car you have 100 miles and 7 days to report any defects. panels gaps aren't as much of a problem anymore compared to years past, but be on the lookout for them. paint quality isn't so great out of the factory, mine came with swirl marks all over and had to get it paint corrected.
if you're concerned about battery degradation, you can take a look at this site [teslalogger.de] (select dropdown and look for Y LR AWD US to see the average degradation over time based on mileage. on average after 50k miles you should see about a 10% degradation, and it will degrade more slowly 50k+ miles onwards.
in terms of accessories, the only real requirement imo that you need are mud flaps. reason being is because without them, the rear passenger quarter panels will get hit with rock chips very quickly. tesmanian is a good aftermarket seller, or you can just opt for ones you see on amazon. if you want to go deeper into accessories temu is a great site for low prices compared to amazon.
if you like to nerd out on graphs, data, and overal health of your vehicle, get a program called teslamate that can be installed on your home server. every time your car parks in your garage it will send driving telemetry data to it with pretty graphs [teslamate.org] and all.
you can also opt to get teslausb [github.com], which can wirelessly send all your dashcam footage to your home server every time you pull into your garage.
my personal thoughts on ownership thus far. overall i like it. i am using it as a daily driver / commuter car. i don't think of Model Y and 3 as a 'luxury' vehicle. I see Tesla as a software company trying to be an automaker, and the legacy automakers are trying to be more like Tesla by being more tech focused. Teslas are continuously getting software updates to improve year over year. Interior build quality is spartan, and the ride quality need some improvement, especially if you are in an area with poor road conditions. if you're really into tech like me, this is the car for you. Performance vehicles I still prefer ICE cars over EV's however. first thing you will notice in an EV though, is the instant torque. that is what will grab you immediately.
Where is your blog or other socials? Would love to subscribe! I am not too keen on switching to a spartan ev yet but loved your insights!! ✌️
In that "dream" scenario it'll be
$45k - $7.5k federal - $4k state - $4k employer incentive - no NJ sales tax. Yeah, I'll buy a 5th car if I can get a Y for $29.5 plus destination charges. So what if it is white. I'll wrap it.
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But won't, they know the market conditions.
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