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How a cell phone picture led to girl's suicide

5,315 707 October 23, 2010 at 02:46 PM in Chat (2)

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the Drunken Snowman
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Phrozt
10-25-2010 at 08:46 AM.
10-25-2010 at 08:46 AM.
Quote from SlicKitty :
I'm sure that you three (in my quotes below) were all angelic when you were 13 and never did anything that you could have been embarrassed over, if it had come out in the news. I mean, surely no one with a videocamera could have caught you...oh...I don't know...playing with yourself? Stealing? Playing doctor? Vandalizing? Setting something on fire? Beating someone up? Getting beaten up? Doing something that could have called your sexuality into question?
See.. that's what you keep missing. This wasn't "someone with w/a videotape catching her doing something." This was HER taking the picture, HER sending it out.

Quote from SlicKitty :
But it could have been taken out of context and made into something big by kids (and adults) with nasty dispositions, who wanted to ruin your life. Just because it didn't happen to you doesn't mean it couldn't have happened to you.
That's 100% false. It literally *could not happen to me* because I didn't do that stuff when I was 13.

Have I made other bad decisions? Yes. Have I been caught for them? Yes. You don't see me killing myself over them.

She was the one pulling all the strings here, yet the last person you want to put any responsibility on is her.
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shuriken
10-25-2010 at 10:19 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:19 AM.
Quote from SlicKitty :
What kind of grown person uses the word "whore" to describe a 13 year old girl? I guess the answer (for me) is - not the kind of person I want to hear from.
Quote :
Camwhores typically suffer from internet disease and engage in constant shameless self promotion.
Quote :
Camwhore is no longer a derogatory epithet.

Typically any term ending in the suffix whore is deemed negative, but much like the terms attention whore and drama whore, the term camwhore has been appropriated into comical and friendly usage. No longer a derogatory epithet, the term is descriptive at worst and friendly or complimentary at best.
Dontknow
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Joined Dec 2004
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shuriken
10-25-2010 at 10:25 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:25 AM.
Quote from Phrozt :
See.. that's what you keep missing. This wasn't "someone with w/a videotape catching her doing something." This was HER taking the picture, HER sending it out.

That's 100% false. It literally *could not happen to me* because I didn't do that stuff when I was 13.

Have I made other bad decisions? Yes. Have I been caught for them? Yes. You don't see me killing myself over them.

She was the one pulling all the strings here, yet the last person you want to put any responsibility on is her.
it's amazing how an individual loses their culpability when they commit suicide. of course, most of us wouldn't think any differently of their actions, if they were still alive. shake head
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itxtwhlstdrvng
10-25-2010 at 10:36 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:36 AM.
Quote from SlicKitty :
Exactly. Lots of people of all ages make stupid mistakes and children don't have the life-experience to know that not everyone can be trusted. The poor kid thought she could trust her boyfriend with a naughty picture and he betrayed her and she could have just taken it as a learning experience.

Instead, it was all blown out of proportion by hundreds (maybe more) other kids, who weren't involved and shouldn't have had anything to do with it. If it had stayed between her, her boyfriend, and a few other people, she probably wouldn't have become so distraught, but to her, it probably felt like the whole world knew and the whole world thought these terrible things about her...and always would.

As we saw from the college kid who just took his own life, even older people make these same "moment in time" decisions, so why would it surprise anyone that a child would make a decision like that?

And why would any thinking adult propagate the idea that she was anything but an experimenting child?

No wonder our kids treat each other this way. Look how adults are willing to talk about kids and the names they're willing to throw around - how they're willing to question the character of a child who tried something out once and got caught.

I'm sure that you three (in my quotes below) were all angelic when you were 13 and never did anything that you could have been embarrassed over, if it had come out in the news. I mean, surely no one with a videocamera could have caught you...oh...I don't know...playing with yourself? Stealing? Playing doctor? Vandalizing? Setting something on fire? Beating someone up? Getting beaten up? Doing something that could have called your sexuality into question?

Just something small. Nothing big.

But it could have been taken out of context and made into something big by kids (and adults) with nasty dispositions, who wanted to ruin your life. Just because it didn't happen to you doesn't mean it couldn't have happened to you.
I agree with everything you said.

I've had girlfriends send me pictures. It's a private thing between me and the girl. It takes a lot of trust to send someone a picture. It's embarrassing enough to know that he showed someone.. but for it to turn into the center of her life? That's horrifying. This is a 13 year old girl. Kids don't realize that the intense pain they feel is temporary.

People always want to play the blame game. Let's blame the kids, or let's blame the social worker, or let's blame the girl for not being strong enough. How about we just look at what happened and try to prevent it from taking place in the future?

There are shitty people in this world. It's something you have to learn to deal with. There are also a lot of good people. The good people should rally around bully victims and help them. Everyone has a time in their life when they feel weak.

Instead of doing something about bullying, people avoid confrontation. I'm talking about other kids in this situation. Adults in the school system have a responsibility to do something. The bullies should have been warned. Then their parents should have been called and told that if their child didn't stop bullying they would be expelled. Then the parents would set their kids straight. If not the kids should get expelled.

There's a time and a place for joking. I personally felt sick when I read that her mom found her hanging from her favorite scarves. To then read the thread and see people calling her a whore is disgusting. It's the same mentality the bullies have:

"Oh.. well.. she shouldn't have sent the picture if she didn't want her life to be ruined."

That's just an excuse so you can tell yourself you're not a bad person. My heart goes out to the girl's family. I can't even imagine. All I know is that from now on when I see someone being bullied I'm sticking up for them regardless of the situation. No more picking and choosing my battles. You never know. You could be the difference.
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shuriken
10-25-2010 at 10:49 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:49 AM.
Quote from itxtwhlstdrvng :
I've had girlfriends send me pictures.
look at me!!!!11 Whee
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Joined Feb 2009
Tryin to come originale
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tresanus
10-25-2010 at 10:50 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:50 AM.
First off, the lounge would be very lonely if we all started ignoring those who disagreed with our opinions.

The problem here is that people let emotions get involved with their logic. At 13 I am sure we all made mistakes but the difference here is taking responsibility for and learning from your mistakes. I don't think anyone here thinks the situation isn't horribly tragic and I am sure everyone here would prefer if it could have been adverted. That being said the 13 year old made a huge mistake by sending the pictures out but she made an even larger (exponentially) when she decided to take her own life.

My first thought would be the parenting. At 13 she should have the morals instilled that your "private" parts are meant to be private. What I don't understand is why everyone NEEDS to find someone/something to blame? Why do humans always find the need to take responsibility out of the individuals hands? Either we are capable of making our own decisions or we are not. If we are then we are responsible for the decisions that we do make.
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stimpy
10-25-2010 at 10:55 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:55 AM.
Where the hell is the solidarity?

I can not believe the ladies of the lounge have not posted their tatas in a clear showing of support for this poor child. How many lives could be saved if we just make breastessess pix more "the norm"?

It's sad really.
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the Drunken Snowman
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Phrozt
10-25-2010 at 10:58 AM.
10-25-2010 at 10:58 AM.
Quote from itxtwhlstdrvng :
Lots of words
It was still all HER CHOICE.

When I was in 4th grade, I hand picked a rose out of my mom's garden, made a little tin foil/wet paper towel thing to keep it nice, and put it in her desk before school to avoid anyone seeing.

She gave it back to me in front of the whole class w/a disgusted look on her face and everyone laughed at me. They joked about it for weeks and another guy who was interested in her (and popular) got a bunch of kids to chase me around the playground and he whipped me repeatedly w/a jump rope (the kind that has the plastic sections on all of it to make it heavy).

And yet.. I didn't kill myself.
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tresanus
10-25-2010 at 11:02 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:02 AM.
Quote from Phrozt :
It was still all HER CHOICE.

When I was in 4th grade, I hand picked a rose out of my mom's garden, made a little tin foil/wet paper towel thing to keep it nice, and put it in her desk before school to avoid anyone seeing.

She gave it back to me in front of the whole class w/a disgusted look on her face and everyone laughed at me. They joked about it for weeks and another guy who was interested in her (and popular) got a bunch of kids to chase me around the playground and he whipped me repeatedly w/a jump rope (the kind that has the plastic sections on all of it to make it heavy).

And yet.. I didn't kill myself.
"You sleep in the bed you make" worship
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itxtwhlstdrvng
10-25-2010 at 11:07 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:07 AM.
Quote from Phrozt :
It was still all HER CHOICE.

When I was in 4th grade, I hand picked a rose out of my mom's garden, made a little tin foil/wet paper towel thing to keep it nice, and put it in her desk before school to avoid anyone seeing.

She gave it back to me in front of the whole class w/a disgusted look on her face and everyone laughed at me. They joked about it for weeks and another guy who was interested in her (and popular) got a bunch of kids to chase me around the playground and he whipped me repeatedly w/a jump rope (the kind that has the plastic sections on all of it to make it heavy).

And yet.. I didn't kill myself.
Congrats. This girl did. Let's make an invisible balance scale with our hands and pretend like we can compare your pain to hers. I'm sure her family would love to hear your story of triumph.
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Joined Jul 2004
Magically Delicious
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SlicKitty
10-25-2010 at 11:12 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:12 AM.
Quote from tresanus :
First off, the lounge would be very lonely if we all started ignoring those who disagreed with our opinions.

First off, that's not what I do.

Next, the Lounge isn't lonely for me at all, but I appreciate your caring.

Quote from tresanus :
Why do humans always find the need to take responsibility out of the individuals hands? Either we are capable of making our own decisions or we are not. If we are then we are responsible for the decisions that we do make.
Because you're not born capable of making your own decisions, or you'd be born able to dress yourself, feed yourself, bathe yourself, etc. and you wouldn't need a mother. You learn over a period of time and that period of time is different for everyone. You learn from your parents. You learn through experiences. You learn through mistakes. And, you should have the breadth to do so facing an appropriate amount of adversity. The reaction to a picture of her boob was disproportionate to the mistake she made, which is why she wasn't able to learn appropriately.

And it may/may not have had anything to do with her parents' teaching, because teaching is only part of learning. Experiences contribute far more to learning than teaching does.

Quote from itxtwhlstdrvng :
Congrats. This girl did. Let's make an invisible balance scale with our hands and pretend like we can compare your pain to hers. I'm sure her family would love to hear your story of triumph.
laugh out loud Seriously. Write a tale of woe.

And since I can read his post in the quote, I'll just say that - What happened to you happened once, in front of a handful of people.
What happened to this girl crossed several schools, the Internet, involved her naked body, and involved (what seemed to her like) her whole world over an extended period of time.

Apples/oranges.

Your experience of unrequited love doesn't even compare.
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Last edited by SlicKitty October 25, 2010 at 11:25 AM.
Joined Jan 2008
the Drunken Snowman
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Phrozt
10-25-2010 at 11:16 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:16 AM.
Quote from itxtwhlstdrvng :
Congrats. This girl did. Let's make an invisible balance scale with our hands and pretend like we can compare your pain to hers. I'm sure her family would love to hear your story of triumph.
All I'm saying is that you make your own choices, face the consequences, and go on from there. Assigning blame to everyone but the person who made the choice(s) is sad. No one made her take the pic and send it out... no one made her kill herself. SHE chose those choices.
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Nikayla
10-25-2010 at 11:19 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:19 AM.
Quote from R1Budha :
True.
However you CAN control who they go hang out with.
It's called parenting.
Not letting your kid do what they want.

wanna bet that cell phone had gps in it and the parent could track it easily?

not only that, i net it was on the parents account and thus controllable what could and could not be done with it.

And finally, the parent should be checking the phone periodically to see what the child is doing.
it's a child, not an adult. don't treat them like an adult until they prove they ARE an adult.
You may think you can controll who your child hangs out with but I honestly don't think you can, not ALL the time. Not unless you are with them 24/7. My sister finally got a call from the school that my niece had been repetitavely tardy for and now missing her class after lunch. Turns out she had a boyfriend and they were sneaking off to his house to smoke pot and who knows what else and she is only 15. My sister is very strict and controlling, probably to much, maybe that is why my neice is rebelling so bad. She is all up in her daughters bizness, knowing all her friends and has strict rules who she hangs out with after school. During school however my sister is not able to be there to helecopter parent because she is at work. So her daughter did hang out with people who my sister didn't want her too. A bad boy.

Quote from serra :
this bullying shit breaks my heart. the article linked in this thread has been on my mind all day. it just sucks.
Same here, I wish there was a easy answer. I was bullied and my most frequent wish was to be invisable.

Quote from setsail :
Problem is school are only paying lip service to the bully free zone stance, in my experience. There was a bully on the school bus that my kids rode last year, and at least once each week he was doing something. Throwing things at other kids, spitting on kids, kicking kids, knocking littler kids down. My kids would tell me about the incidents, and I would call the school because obviously the bus driver wasn't reporting it.

One day, he tried to pick on MY son, who doesn't take crap from anyone. My son pushed back, and my son was suspended for a day. I was also asked to make alternate arrangements for him to get home from school each day for a few days. The bully? He still rode the bus. I know because I asked my older child every day if the little jerk was on the bus.

Scratchhead Now that I think about it, I wonder if he was the bus driver's kid or something, there was some reason that his behavior was allowed to continue.
I don't know, I mean, I see the reasoning that the bus driver should watch the kids BUT; driving needs 100% attention. Do you really want to bus driver babysitting kids and not paying attention to the traffic and roads where in a split second if he makes a wrong move all of their lives could be in danger? Maybe we need to pay more taxes and have a bus driver assistant on boad to keep the bullies in line. That is why I sat closer to the front of the bus, the bullies in the back couldn't spit the spit wads far enough to get to me. Sadwalk

Quote from damsel. :
Agree to disagree then. I think a picture is worse.
Not that I have ever flashed anyone (DH excluded Evil ) but I agree a pic is worse. But you can never really be sure someone else doesn't have a camera/phone to catch that flash.

Quote from Phrozt :
She chose to make that mistake, and she chose to end her life.

It was literally in her own hands. Blaming other people isn't the key.



What type of 13 yr old girl texts a pic of her tits out to her bf?
A very young girl who just made a mistake.
My peditration told me that there was a new study done and 100% (yes 100%!) of 13 year old girls have low to VERY low self esteem. He was shocked since he has a 13 yr old and didn't think she did. But after talking to his own 13 yr old realized she did struggle with self worth.

You all who are judging a 13 yr old female so harshly shame on you. And I do not say that because it is something I did or would have done. I was way to mortified and had no boyfriends. But I did know girls who let boys feel them up or give them peeks and those boys are very manipulative. They know just what to say and do to get some of the girls to trust them and do what they want. Some girls and boys are more desperate for acceptance and attention than others and that makes them the most vunerable to these manipulators and bullies.
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tresanus
10-25-2010 at 11:20 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:20 AM.
Quote from SlicKitty :
First off, that's not what I do.

Next, the Lounge isn't lonely for me at all, but I appreciate your caring.
Thumbsup
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ForeverDecember
10-25-2010 at 11:22 AM.
10-25-2010 at 11:22 AM.
Quote from itxtwhlstdrvng :
Congrats. This girl did. Let's make an invisible balance scale with our hands and pretend like we can compare your pain to hers. I'm sure her family would love to hear your story of triumph.
How is it much different? She was embarassed and teased, he was embarassed and teased. Because it was her boobs it is different?

Teasing hurts, a lot. Go through it every day for a long period of time and it really gets to you. The difference is that her teasing was brought on by her own actions, actions that no 13 year old should be participating in. It doesn't make it right that she took her life, but she couldn't handle it. There are plenty of people to blame. The parents, the teachers, the social worker, the kids, the friends and even the girl.
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