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Forum Thread

Santa Barbara murders

12,104 277 May 26, 2014 at 05:56 AM in News (2)
Hundreds gathered at a memorial service Sunday night to mourn six young people killed two nights earlier by a gunman in a California college town.


Elliot Rodger, 22, the son of a Hollywood director, fatally stabbed three people in his apartment before shooting dead three others on Friday in Isla Vista, near the University of California at Santa Barbara campus. He then shot himself.
Rodger killed two women and four men, aged 19 to 22, and wounded 13 people, including eight who he shot as he sped through town in his black BMW, exchanging fire with police, authorities said.
Minutes before opening fire the former community college student emailed his plans to some 30 people including his mother, father and former teachers, said Cathleen Bloeser, whose son was a childhood friend of Rodger and received a copy.
Rodger stated his intention to kill his housemates, lure others to his home to continue the mayhem then slaughter women in a sorority and bring his spree to the streets of Isla Vista.
The manifesto, which details Rodger's fear that his guns might have been discovered when police visited him less than a month ago, was not the first indication of a troubled mind.

Linky [chicagotribune.com]


Am I the only one who sees the results of raising a self-esteem based "everyone gets a trophy" generation here? When everyone gets a trophy and every child is constantly told that they are special and everything they do is amazing, they never learn how to deal with rejection and failure. Failure is part of life and shielding children from it to preserve their self esteem is like smothering your child in antibiotics their whole life to protect them from getting sick and then wondering why they have no immune system when they grow up. If a child never learns how to cope with losing and being wrong, when they reach adulthood they don't have the mental faculties to deal with the failure they will invariably encounter in their adult lives. The guy who shot those innocent people in Santa Barbara claims that it was revenge for being rejected by the girls and the popular kids at his college. I was rejected by girls and popular kids my entire life and shooting a bunch of people never entered my mind. Maybe instead of giving our kids a trophy when they lose, we should teach them that losing is a part of life and give them the tools that they need to cope with failure, learn from it, and then get on with their lives.

Just a thought.



I hope this thread doesn't end up in The Place That Shall Not Be Named.

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Joined Oct 2004
Professor Fishslapper!
> bubble2 12,104 Posts
277 Reputation
Original Poster
dalokgawd
05-26-2014 at 03:46 PM.
05-26-2014 at 03:46 PM.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Glad to see you enjoy it so much. Coverlaugh
I do enjoy it. I don't enjoy dealing with some of my students, but the vast majority don't cause problems and I do enjoy the teaching. The results of the self esteem philosophy in the lower grades is a particular pet peeve of mine and that does frustrate me. But just because I find that particular aspect frustrating doesn't mean that I don't enjoy the rest of it.

Quote from Iaaaiws :
Serious question though:

I saw that mentality from a lot of kids when I was still in school and I'm sure it is a lot worse now. I only had a couple of professors/instructors who wouldn't put up with the whiny bullshit and from your posts I wouldn't think you would tolerate it either.

You are fortunate to be in a position to do something about the behavior of these "lazy self entitled kids". How do you handle that and what do you do individually to attempt to make them see life differently?
I set strict policies and then I enforce them without exception. Often times I have students who want me to make an exception for them and I staunchly refuse to do so. I point to the policy as it is written in my syllabus, and I tell them that the rules are the rules and that they have to abide by them just like everyone else does. Part of my job is to prepare these kids to start their careers once they graduate and I am not shy about telling them that in the real world, no boss is going to tolerate excuses for things like missing deadlines or failing to complete assignments. I then inform them that while they may not like the consequences of whatever rule they have broken, my consequences are much lighter than the consequences they would face for similar behavior in the workforce and that they should take the experience as a learning lesson so that they don't make the same mistake in their future job. Most students, once they realize that I am not going to bend, take it fairly well.


A lot of professors will let students make up late work or assignments that they didn't turn in. A lot of professors don't have any penalties for missing class. A lot of professors drop the lowest exam grade or the lowest homework grade. I don't do these things because in the real world if you screw up an assignment, your boss is not going to "drop" your failure. So I want my students to get used to a real world attitude. It's more work for me, but like I said, I view it as part of my job to get them ready to face real world challenges.

Quote from Iaaaiws :
Wait, do you mean like you haven't read anything I posted here and just automatically go on about how I blame liberals for everything? Pot, meet kettle. Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)

Aren't the educators of our kids supposed to be open minded and not fall into the trap of preconceived notions?
BTW bunny... here are some examples of you blaming liberals for all sorts of stuff. And these are all just from the first page and a half of the three pages of search results I got from searching for posts of yours containing the word liberal. Now stop playing the martyr and pretending like I am wrongly accusing you of blaming liberals for stuff.
Bunny blaming liberals for bullies beating up schoolchildren.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Ibet that almost makes you question what it is you like so much about liberalpolicies.

Whoever shows up from CPS gets their ass beat aswell. Once you take on a problem you have to be willing to see it through tothe end.
Bunny blaming liberals for people getting out of speeding tickets.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Typicalliberal behavior--not taking responsibility for their actions.

Bunny blaming liberals for the existence of greed.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Thisis the mentality that becomes more and more prevalent in today's entitlementsociety when getting free stuff becomes the norm rather than the exception.

The ultimate result of liberalism.

Bunny blaming liberals for threads getting locked? Confused
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Ah,the ol' "treat the symptom not the cause"

Makes sense from a liberal perspective I guess.

We're going bankrupt, should we raise the limit onour credit cards or stop spending so much?
Bunny still blaming liberals for people being able to get out of speeding tickets.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Avoidingpersonal responsibility due to a technicality?

You would make a pretty good liberal.

Bunny blaming liberals for chaos on Black Friday.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Thisis one of the prices of becoming a "progressive" society. Keep votingfor liberals and putting them in power and this is what we get in return. Itwill all sort itself out eventually but by then it may be too late to fixthings. Get used to this kind of crap becoming the norm.
Reply
Last edited by dalokgawd May 26, 2014 at 03:51 PM.
Joined Jan 2004
Here's to the future
> bubble2 25,141 Posts
707 Reputation
Iaaaiws
05-26-2014 at 03:56 PM.
05-26-2014 at 03:56 PM.
Quote from dalokgawd :
I do enjoy it. I don't enjoy dealing with some of my students, but the vast majority don't cause problems and I do enjoy the teaching. The results of the self esteem philosophy in the lower grades is a particular pet peeve of mine and that does frustrate me. But just because I find that particular aspect frustrating doesn't mean that I don't enjoy the rest of it.
Oh I get that and understand what drives a dedicated teacher. I wish they were all that way. I was just attempting a little humor, not seriously saying you didn't actually enjoy it. laugh out loud

Quote :
I set strict policies and then I enforce them without exception. Often times I have students who want me to make an exception for them and I staunchly refuse to do so. I point to the policy as it is written in my syllabus, and I tell them that the rules are the rules and that they have to abide by them just like everyone else does. Part of my job is to prepare these kids to start their careers once they graduate and I am not shy about telling them that in the real world, no boss is going to tolerate excuses for things like missing deadlines or failing to complete assignments. I then inform them that while they may not like the consequences of whatever rule they have broken, my consequences are much lighter than the consequences they would face for similar behavior in the workforce and that they should take the experience as a learning lesson so that they don't make the same mistake in their future job. Most students, once they realize that I am not going to bend, take it fairly well.


A lot of professors will let students make up late work or assignments that they didn't turn in. A lot of professors don't have any penalties for missing class. A lot of professors drop the lowest exam grade or the lowest homework grade. I don't do these things because in the real world if you screw up an assignment, your boss is not going to "drop" your failure. So I want my students to get used to a real world attitude. It's more work for me, but like I said, I view it as part of my job to get them ready to face real world challenges.
Great! More should follow that approach. Unfortunately they don't, as you say. What is also unfortunate is that you will get the reputation of being a tough professor and the laziest students will avoid your classes like the plague when scheduling (assuming there are alternate choices--I have no idea what you even teach). That can be good for you because you will end up with the more dedicated students but bad because the ones who need to learn that discipline may not get it.

Personally I used to pick the tougher professors in college because I wanted to learn, not just coast through. It almost always paid off. In a few rare instances the tougher ones weren't always that great at teaching.
Reply
Joined Jul 2006
CDI gave me free netflix!
> bubble2 51,186 Posts
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dzap
05-26-2014 at 03:57 PM.
05-26-2014 at 03:57 PM.
Quote from Maleficent :
Knowing the two of you? Yeah, yeah I would. laugh out loud



I play GTA! Whee

I'm pretty sure we discussed this at length with the last shooting... Scratchhead

Oh, right, you can beat them to death with a baseball bat, golf club, crowbar or your bare hands. You can also set them on fire with a molotov cocktail. Other than that though, my post covered everything else you do in GTA to kill people. laugh out loud



Roll

You know you can't force a cat to do anything! They like chasing and eating the bugs, I just have to show them where it is. LMAO

Stick Out Tongue And Besides..stabbing is ineffective if you want absolute kills. I play GTA as well. What me and my friend would do, is he would get a chopper, and I would get the tank. Hook chopper to tank and I would just blast away around the entire city as we flew around. More or less invincible.


Anything less than that, and it's not worth my time to execute a mass murder killing spree. Stick Out Tongue
Reply
Joined Jan 2004
Here's to the future
> bubble2 25,141 Posts
707 Reputation
Iaaaiws
05-26-2014 at 04:00 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:00 PM.
Quote from dalokgawd :
BTW bunny... here are some examples of you blaming liberals for all sorts of stuff. And these are all just from the first page and a half of the three pages of search results I got from searching for posts of yours containing the word liberal. Now stop playing the martyr and pretending like I am wrongly accusing you of blaming liberals for stuff.
Bunny blaming liberals for bullies beating up schoolchildren.

Bunny blaming liberals for people getting out of speeding tickets.



Bunny blaming liberals for the existence of greed.



Bunny blaming liberals for threads getting locked? Confused


Bunny still blaming liberals for people being able to get out of speeding tickets.



Bunny blaming liberals for chaos on Black Friday.
But at least all of it is true. Wink

Btw, I bet you can't stop feeding off your own hate and say positive and nice things about me like I just did to you.


Popcorn
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Joined Nov 2005
quick, like a bunny
> bubble2 28,148 Posts
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cav
05-26-2014 at 04:04 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:04 PM.
your fingernails and toenails are rather well maintained for a bunny rabbit.
Reply
Joined Jan 2007
The Mistress of All Evil!
> bubble2 22,510 Posts
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Maleficent
05-26-2014 at 04:06 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:06 PM.
Quote from dzap :
Stick Out Tongue And Besides..stabbing is ineffective if you want absolute kills. I play GTA as well. What me and my friend would do, is he would get a chopper, and I would get the tank. Hook chopper to tank and I would just blast away around the entire city as we flew around. More or less invincible.


Anything less than that, and it's not worth my time to execute a mass murder killing spree. Stick Out Tongue
Well, yes, less effective if you're trying to kill other players online. It's perfectly effective for killing pedestrians on the street, which is more akin to what we were discussing, I thought.
Reply
Joined Jul 2006
CDI gave me free netflix!
> bubble2 51,186 Posts
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dzap
05-26-2014 at 04:08 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:08 PM.
Quote from Maleficent :
Well, yes, less effective if you're trying to kill other players online. It's perfectly effective for killing pedestrians on the street, which is more akin to what we were discussing, I thought.
You seem to have given this more thought than I have Mal. Scratchchin


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Joined Jan 2007
The Mistress of All Evil!
> bubble2 22,510 Posts
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Maleficent
05-26-2014 at 04:14 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:14 PM.
Quote from dzap :
You seem to have given this more thought than I have Mal. Scratchchin


Hide
Does it not make sense? We're discussing murdering a bunch of Californians - they'll be unarmed and unable to defend themselves. Seems like the random computer simulated people in the game to me. laugh out loud

I gave it about two seconds of thought... you didn't even give it that much?!
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Joined Aug 2010
FW expatriot
> bubble2 1,218 Posts
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germanpope
05-26-2014 at 04:43 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:43 PM.
The scary thing was that music from the 80's he was playing. His videos could have been made all the way back in my day. While some things change, a lot of things are exactly the same.
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Joined Oct 2004
Professor Fishslapper!
> bubble2 12,104 Posts
277 Reputation
Original Poster
dalokgawd
05-26-2014 at 04:59 PM.
05-26-2014 at 04:59 PM.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
Oh I get that and understand what drives a dedicated teacher. I wish they were all that way. I was just attempting a little humor, not seriously saying you didn't actually enjoy it. laugh out loud



Great! More should follow that approach. Unfortunately they don't, as you say. What is also unfortunate is that you will get the reputation of being a tough professor and the laziest students will avoid your classes like the plague when scheduling (assuming there are alternate choices--I have no idea what you even teach). That can be good for you because you will end up with the more dedicated students but bad because the ones who need to learn that discipline may not get it.

Personally I used to pick the tougher professors in college because I wanted to learn, not just coast through. It almost always paid off. In a few rare instances the tougher ones weren't always that great at teaching.
I actually have a 4.9/5 rating on ratemyprofessor.com right now. I am a tough professor, but I'm fair. And I work really hard to make sure that the ones who want to do well can do that. I remind them when assignments are due. I go over the most important parts of the previous lecture at the beginning of the class. I give them a review before each exam. I spend 2 hours doing a practice problem session before the final. So the ones who are willing to put the work in have every opportunity to do well. I do have my share of slackers who don't put any effort into the class and bomb it, but I haven't had any of them give me crappy ratings. Maybe deep down they know it's their fault they failed and not mine? I don't know. I'm sure that my rating is so high because I'm still fairly new, and it won't last forever, but I'll enjoy it while I can.
Reply
Joined Oct 2004
Professor Fishslapper!
> bubble2 12,104 Posts
277 Reputation
Original Poster
dalokgawd
05-26-2014 at 05:06 PM.
05-26-2014 at 05:06 PM.
Quote from Iaaaiws :
But at least all of it is true. Wink

Btw, I bet you can't stop feeding off your own hate and say positive and nice things about me like I just did to you.


Popcorn
You are very good at blaming liberals for a ton of shit while complaining when other people accuse you of doing exactly that?
Reply
Joined Jul 2009
I am
> bubble2 18,145 Posts
2,760 Reputation
iamiamian
05-26-2014 at 05:08 PM.
05-26-2014 at 05:08 PM.
Quote from dalokgawd :
You are very good at blaming liberals for a ton of shit while complaining when other people accuse you of doing exactly that?
I am sorry but your answer was in the form of a question rather than in a compliment, you lose.
Reply
Joined Oct 2004
Professor Fishslapper!
> bubble2 12,104 Posts
277 Reputation
Original Poster
dalokgawd
05-26-2014 at 05:10 PM.
05-26-2014 at 05:10 PM.
Quote from Foreveryours :
I am sorry but your answer was in the form of a question rather than in a compliment, you lose.
Crying
Reply
Joined Jan 2004
Here's to the future
> bubble2 25,141 Posts
707 Reputation
Iaaaiws
05-26-2014 at 05:14 PM.
05-26-2014 at 05:14 PM.
Quote from dalokgawd :
You are very good at blaming liberals for a ton of shit while complaining when other people accuse you of doing exactly that?
I think you have had your fill of hate for the day. Maybe it is time for dessert. yummy

Everyone else seems to be having a lot of fun in this thread. It is sad that you have to be so stodgy and bitter. Loosen up a little.
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Joined Dec 2003
Benevolent Dictator
> bubble2 32,001 Posts
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The Raddish
05-26-2014 at 05:21 PM.
05-26-2014 at 05:21 PM.
Quote from dalokgawd :
I actually have a 4.9/5 rating on ratemyprofessor.com right now. I am a tough professor, but I'm fair. And I work really hard to make sure that the ones who want to do well can do that. I remind them when assignments are due. I go over the most important parts of the previous lecture at the beginning of the class. I give them a review before each exam. I spend 2 hours doing a practice problem session before the final. So the ones who are willing to put the work in have every opportunity to do well. I do have my share of slackers who don't put any effort into the class and bomb it, but I haven't had any of them give me crappy ratings. Maybe deep down they know it's their fault they failed and not mine? I don't know. I'm sure that my rating is so high because I'm still fairly new, and it won't last forever, but I'll enjoy it while I can.
You seem to have quite a conservative philosophy to teaching. That's refreshing.

What subject do you teach?
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