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Only read if you are NOT religious and/or do not believe in any 'supreme' being (othe

77,018 212,304 December 2, 2007 at 08:48 PM in Question
personal attacks will not be tolerated and will be mod alerted, if you wish to set someone apart use generalities, such as specific religion not speific person on SD for example

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you dont get the right to feel insulted, u have been warned...

so, peeps, if you dont believe in god, do you feel that ones that do are delusional?

a lot of people will sight karma or other things as 'he got what he had coming' but i argue that it's all a mathematical randomness that on a small scale might seem like karma

perfect example is: when you play poker and u push with the best hand, a LOT of times, you can predict/be so sure that the card will come that will beat you even if the chance of it coming is less than 1:6. when the card comes, some might argue it as karma, but i argue that its all random, just on a small scale randomness doesn't work

discuss....
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Last Edited by Ram|bunc|tious December 6, 2007 at 06:15 AM


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Joined Dec 2003
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Mavtech
12-04-2007 at 01:40 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:40 PM.
Here's another way I look at religion:

Since I am a "fence sitter" and do no declare to be a member of any religion, as far as I know, we are all going to hell. I can't say which religion is correct or if any of them is correct. According to one religion or another, we are all going to hell (if it exists). I'm just trying to upgrade my room. Maybe at least a fan? I can't sleep when it's hot.
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Drio
12-04-2007 at 01:40 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:40 PM.
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Chivalry-never outdated
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Just Peachy
12-04-2007 at 01:40 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:40 PM.
Quote from IVIax :
1. It's a human trait wanting to be credit and praised for things, if god is actually above us all and not human, then he should not posses this superficial triat.
Why would you think it's a human trait only? If you err, wouldn't you want to be corrected? God created man in His image, not the reverse.
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Fallacy
12-04-2007 at 01:42 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:42 PM.
Quote from sassysour :
Yes, a man went to school for 7 years to be a doctor. Can anyone become a doctor? Can anyone be a musician? Can anyone be a writer? A theologist? A teacher? I don't think anyone can be those things. This is where we say God gave him the gift. The doctor professes to serving God, and gives God the glory for this gift.
DA: If the person who saved slickkitty wasn't there, another doctor would have been. He might not have been the top rated surgeon in the country, but he might have done an OK job and she still would have lived. We'll never know.


Quote from killerbootsman :
In my opinion, Christians apply way to many humanly traits to God.
Iagree (and I think I've stated that a few pages back, or maybe even on this page)
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Fallacy
12-04-2007 at 01:46 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:46 PM.
Quote from Peachyum :
Why would you think it's a human trait only? If you err, wouldn't you want to be corrected? God created man in His image, not the reverse.
If god created man in his image, then my theories could be correct: people could have telepathy or even telekinesis's powers, but have not fully discovered on how to use them.

But seriously: if god created man in his image, then why are men not almighty, not merciful, not just, not etc. People are bad (for the most part), period. You could say they strayed (or err'ed), but even if we look back into biblical times (or slightly past), people are bad.
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killerbootsman
12-04-2007 at 01:48 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:48 PM.
Quote from Peachyum :
Why would you think it's a human trait only? If you err, wouldn't you want to be corrected? God created man in His image, not the reverse.
Would you agree that it could be a flaw that some of us as humans want credit for things we do? Don't you think the world would be a much better place if I could hold the door open for th e person behind me, and even if they didn't say "thank you" I would still love them and hold the door open for them a million more times because I wouldn't be even thinking of the recognition I should be receiving. Instead some of as humans won't hold the door open for them again, because they only held the door open for the praise, not the desire to help out another.
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~Kimber~
12-04-2007 at 01:51 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:51 PM.
Quote from Drio :
:whee3: here we come! laugh out loud
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Mavtech
12-04-2007 at 01:55 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:55 PM.
Quote from killerbootsman :
Would you agree that it could be a flaw that some of us as humans want credit for things we do? Don't you think the world would be a much better place if I could hold the door open for th e person behind me, and even if they didn't say "thank you" I would still love them and hold the door open for them a million more times because I wouldn't be even thinking of the recognition I should be receiving. Instead some of as humans won't hold the door open for them again, because they only held the door open for the praise, not the desire to help out another.
I agree. I always wonder why people give credit where they are not sure credit is due. Some people have a skill that others do not. How do we know it was God who went through each one of us and chose what skill we should or shouldn't have? Why isn't it genetics combined with hard work and practice? I sat in class all those years to get the HS diploma and then the college degree and then my tech certs. My mother and brother were the ones who sparked my interest in computers that led me the awesome job I have now. I happened to walk into the correct employment agency 6 years ago that put me in this company. What small shred of evidence or reason do I have to give someone other than myself (and chance) the credit?
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Fallacy
12-04-2007 at 01:55 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:55 PM.
Quote from killerbootsman :
Would you agree that it could be a flaw that some of us as humans want credit for things we do? Don't you think the world would be a much better place if I could hold the door open for th e person behind me, and even if they didn't say "thank you" I would still love them and hold the door open for them a million more times because I wouldn't be even thinking of the recognition I should be receiving. Instead some of as humans won't hold the door open for them again, because they only held the door open for the praise, not the desire to help out another.
That's not the reason (in some cases), you do it for the desire to help out another person, but if that person is going to be egoistical/self-centered and not respond, why would you want to help them out again? (unless you really do have a golden heart)
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sassysour
12-04-2007 at 01:56 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:56 PM.
Quote from killerbootsman :
In my opinion, Christians apply way to many humanly traits to God.

- God won't accept us into Heaven unless we give him recognition and praise.
-God will "only be friends with us if we want to be friends with him first"
-Heaven is this country club (of sorts): a special place, only for special people... not everyone is accepted

Killerbootsman, all I can tell you is that everything on your list is twisted truth. Twisted truth is something that is scary, because it is truth that is manipulated.


Your first one~God won't accept us into Heaven unless we give him recognition and praise.

I think this is your attempt to simply define a complicated subject. But you used "accept" incorrectly. God has already done the work. We won't go to heaven if we don't accept his gift of forgiveness.


Your second one~ God will "only be friends with us if we want to be friends with him first"

This statment is also backwards. We love God only because he first loved us. No one ever loved God first.

Your third point~Heaven is this country club (of sorts): a special place, only for special people... not everyone is accepted


Yes, this is correct. God desires that everyone go to heaven, God loves the whole world ( John 3:16 For God so loved the whole word that he gave his only begotten son, that who so ever should believe in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life). God has given you free choice to be a "special person" Wink or not.
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Robor
12-04-2007 at 01:58 PM.
12-04-2007 at 01:58 PM.
Quote from BrgnHntr :
Any of these occurances individually, true. But as you combine the odds of one, with the odds of the next, with the odds of the next, etc. all occuring in succession to one person. Statistically speaking...the odds of it happening just that way are actually miniscule.
Hmmm... Since we're talking about odds lets try to relate it to poker. Say the 2008 WSOP (World Series Of Poker) has 10,000 people. Only 1 of them is going to win the grand prize. Between the beginning and end thousands and thousands of hands will be played and I'm willing to bet several of these 'minuscule probabilities' will occur. The path the eventual winner takes from start to finish will likely require improbable outcomes in succession in his/her favor. To me that's not a miracle. It's a matter of poker skill combined with a lot of luck.
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Just Peachy
12-04-2007 at 02:00 PM.
12-04-2007 at 02:00 PM.
Quote from IVIax :
If god created man in his image, then my theories could be correct: people could have telepathy or even telekinesis's powers, but have not fully discovered on how to use them.

But seriously: if god created man in his image, then why are men not almighty, not merciful, not just, not etc. People are bad (for the most part), period. You could say they strayed (or err'ed), but even if we look back into biblical times (or slightly past), people are bad.
So are you saying your not gifted like the rest of us? Bigeye

People ARE bad for the most part. God even said so. Man is inherently evil. However, do recall that Adam and Eve were as perfect as they could be but they, having free will, did err. Their error and consequent punishment was passed on to their offspring (us). Imperfection bred imperfection.

Quote from killerbootsman :
Would you agree that it could be a flaw that some of us as humans want credit for things we do? Don't you think the world would be a much better place if I could hold the door open for th e person behind me, and even if they didn't say "thank you" I would still love them and hold the door open for them a million more times because I wouldn't be even thinking of the recognition I should be receiving. Instead some of as humans won't hold the door open for them again, because they only held the door open for the praise, not the desire to help out another.
Why would I consider it a flaw on your part to want credit where it's due?
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BrownEyedGirl
12-04-2007 at 02:02 PM.
12-04-2007 at 02:02 PM.
I refuse to turn the other cheek. Nono2 I only have two. I like them both. Harhar
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Robor
12-04-2007 at 02:04 PM.
12-04-2007 at 02:04 PM.
Quote from killerbootsman :
But even if they are minuscule as you have suggested, we live in a world of infinite space and time then, they would eventually have to happen.
Exactly. There's that old saying about a thousand monkeys with typewriters and Shakespeare.
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killerbootsman
12-04-2007 at 02:04 PM.
12-04-2007 at 02:04 PM.
Quote from IVIax :
That's not the reason (in some cases), you do it for the desire to help out another person, but if that person is going to be egoistical/self-centered and not respond, why would you want to help them out again? (unless you really do have a golden heart)
Of course there are not many people who would hold the door open again. I know I wouldn'tlaugh out loud . But when I picture my God, I don't see him as one that would be so easy to condemn. Maybe the person didn't see you holding the door, maybe they didn't know it was common courtesy to say "thank you", maybe we are just in a hurry and don't want to say anything. God will hold the door open for them a trillion more times because he has the power to do it and he knows he just made that person's life a little easier,(even if they don't know it)
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