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Only read if you are NOT religious and/or do not believe in any 'supreme' being (othe
December 2, 2007 at
08:48 PM
in
Question
personal attacks will not be tolerated and will be mod alerted, if you wish to set someone apart use generalities, such as specific religion not speific person on SD for example
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you dont get the right to feel insulted, u have been warned...
so, peeps, if you dont believe in god, do you feel that ones that do are delusional?
a lot of people will sight karma or other things as 'he got what he had coming' but i argue that it's all a mathematical randomness that on a small scale might seem like karma
perfect example is: when you play poker and u push with the best hand, a LOT of times, you can predict/be so sure that the card will come that will beat you even if the chance of it coming is less than 1:6. when the card comes, some might argue it as karma, but i argue that its all random, just on a small scale randomness doesn't work
discuss....
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you dont get the right to feel insulted, u have been warned...
so, peeps, if you dont believe in god, do you feel that ones that do are delusional?
a lot of people will sight karma or other things as 'he got what he had coming' but i argue that it's all a mathematical randomness that on a small scale might seem like karma
perfect example is: when you play poker and u push with the best hand, a LOT of times, you can predict/be so sure that the card will come that will beat you even if the chance of it coming is less than 1:6. when the card comes, some might argue it as karma, but i argue that its all random, just on a small scale randomness doesn't work
discuss....
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Last Edited by Ram|bunc|tious
December 6, 2007
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06:15 AM
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People who went to religious school, who might have been religious before, usually come out agnostic (or change their views shortly in the future). I can name a large handful of people who fall into this category (including myself).
However, I do believe in hell. Hell is when a person chooses NOT to be with God and not to believe in him. To get into the theology of hell is an entirely different story, but the easiest thing to say is that hell is separation from God. And God is pure and good, so that would make hell an uncomfortable place to be, since there is no goodness there. But notice that it's is up to that person whether they want to go there or not... that's what I believe.
If he could look inside me and find a good person worthy of heaven. Great. I just don't like the idea of being denied for the sole reason that I wasn't a member of the fan club.
Again, it's not about me being pissed that I'm not getting in. It's what I find odd about his character.... right from the mouthes of his followers. (and ultimately, that's the reason I don't give the religion more merit) It's probably found in every organized religion.
It looks like the gang is all here now.... were any of you raised without your religion?
"God is Love." How many people believe that? Do I really believe it? I'm sure there are more times I don't than I do. The famous prophet Haddaway once asked, "What is Love?" Maybe once we answer that, we can describe God.
If he could look inside me and find a good person worthy of heaven. Great. I just don't like the idea of being denied for the sole reason that I wasn't a member of the fan club.
Again, it's not about me being pissed that I'm not getting in. It's what I find odd about his character.... right from the mouthes of his followers. (and ultimately, that's the reason I don't give the religion more merit) It's probably found in every organized religion.
It looks like the gang is all here now.... were any of you raised without your religion?
I'm catching up with this thread, but here are a few more thoughts:
Assuming there is a God, no one can say that because Drio chose not to believe during his lifetime, but at the last moment he realizes he was wrong and changes his mind, that he would not be accepted by God.
To me, that completely goes against what Christianity is about; to have that attitude sounds more to me like a personal position based on " Well, why should he get in after doing so little. It's not fair!!" Anyone who tells someone else that they will go to "hell" or will not partake in the afterlife (assuming there is one) is overstepping their boundaries. If one truly believes on God as taught in Christianity, there is no one on Earth able to make a call as to whether or not a certain person can be a part of eternal life.
I feel like I can say this without getting bashed, but when I read this post I agreed with it 100%.
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Assuming there is a God, no one can say that because Drio chose not to believe during his lifetime, but at the last moment he realizes he was wrong and changes his mind, that he would not be accepted by God.
To me, that completely goes against what Christianity is about; to have that attitude sounds more to me like a personal position based on " Well, why should he get in after doing so little. It's not fair!!" Anyone who tells someone else that they will go to "hell" or will not partake in the afterlife (assuming there is one) is overstepping their boundaries. If one truly believes on God as taught in Christianity, there is no one on Earth able to make a call as to whether or not a certain person can be a part of eternal life.
Jesus told a story about this exact scenario. It was about field workers that a man hired for one denarius. As the day wore on the man hired more workers. Right before the end of the day the man hired still more workers. At the end of the day the workers lined up to get paid. The workers who had worked the whole day were angry that they all got the same pay. The man said "you agreed to work for that pay, what is it to you that I pay these men the same?"
Basically I think he was saying that anyone who accepts Jesus as his savior will get to be in heaven. At any point in their life.
The problem with life though, is we never know when God stops protecting us and enter eternal life.
BEG, the reason why it hurts me to know that people do not believe in God is because I don't want anyone to miss out on the peace and love, and goodness I believe waits us on the other side. I understand people have doubts, and don't believe. In a weird way we are in the same place an unborn baby is in; if a baby could have full comprehension in the womb I think it would be pretty incredulous to hear the description of a giraffe. It has nothing to compare it to, within its world, and the giraffe remains invisible to the baby until it enters a world it has never known before.
I don't want anyone to miss out.
I feel like I can say this without getting bashed, but when I read this post I agreed with it 100%.
As far as size goes anyway, we are about as miniscule and unimportant to the universe as the atom is compared to us, or our world. Size is relative. Space is relative. I don't know what is out there, but nothing takes away from my worth from my Father. If my heart can love all my children with the same gut wrenching depth, then I know my Father can love me with the same depth regardless of how many millions of other life forms there are or aren't.
I'm back
Also another philosophical point would be...what if we have no previous knowledge of our past life? I know the bible talks about going to an awesome totally sweet pad just you, JC, g_d and a few billion other peeps drinking brews...but does it talk about past memories...like when you do you will retain all the earthly information.
If you do not it seems kind of moot what kind of life you led and had.
*maybe I understood wrong (wont be the first time)
It has been implied (if not stated directly, I'm too lazy to go back and look) that the christian mindset makes people want to do good things and be better people. People have also stated that on dark days they talk to god and feel better about themselves, so I don't see where my comment is so far fetched? (it might be over simplified...)
True, talking to God does make me feel better, just like talking to my husband or best friend does. I just want to make it clear that it's not a one way relationship 'using' God any more than it would be considered 'using' my husband or friend.
People who went to religious school, who might have been religious before, usually come out agnostic (or change their views shortly in the future). I can name a large handful of people who fall into this category (including myself).
Anyway, (to answer Drio) I was raised going to church, but it was a Calvinist church and fairly different from the Baptist church that I now go to. My family was one of two or three whose kids went to public school (ooh, such heathens!). All the others went to Christian school K-12. I know of one family whose 2 kids have both struggled with their faith but I'm not sure what they believe as of today. I believe all the others are still believers...most church-goers. My sister went to a religious college and doesn't have any school friends who no longer believe.
The Bible does contradict itself on the surface in many different places. From those that I have studied, when you read the full contest of that text the circumstances differ enough that it's not really contradictory. (simple example: "I am hot" "I am cold" one's not a lie, they were both true when they were stated, but the circumstances changed)
Assuming there is a God, no one can say that because Drio chose not to believe during his lifetime, but at the last moment he realizes he was wrong and changes his mind, that he would not be accepted by God.
To me, that completely goes against what Christianity is about; to have that attitude sounds more to me like a personal position based on " Well, why should he get in after doing so little. It's not fair!!" Anyone who tells someone else that they will go to "hell" or will not partake in the afterlife (assuming there is one) is overstepping their boundaries. If one truly believes on God as taught in Christianity, there is no one on Earth able to make a call as to whether or not a certain person can be a part of eternal life.
I feel like I can say this without getting bashed, but when I read this post I agreed with it 100%.
We as humans are the ones who need worship. Why is because that is something that makes sense to humans. We place great things above ourselves, we're in awe of them...it signifies importance. Take a look around at celebrities, new electronics even, nature (some people worship that...are you going to say that nature needs them to?) and world leaders. Popular opinion about our President aside, who wouldn't be slightly in awe to run into Nelson Mandela or Margaret Thatcher? To keep our relationship with God fresh and at the front of our mind, we worship. It's a great way to get back on track, to refresh on how God tells us to live our lives (I'm happier when I live that way...most of the non-Christians here say they try to live by most of those philosophies, just not because of God). It puts him above me and keeps me focused.
Basically I think he was saying that anyone who accepts Jesus as his savior will get to be in heaven. At any point in their life.
The problem with life though, is we never know when God stops protecting us and enter eternal life.
BEG, the reason why it hurts me to know that people do not believe in God is because I don't want anyone to miss out on the peace and love, and goodness I believe waits us on the other side. I understand people have doubts, and don't believe. In a weird way we are in the same place an unborn baby is in; if a baby could have full comprehension in the womb I think it would be pretty incredulous to hear the description of a giraffe. It has nothing to compare it to, within its world, and the giraffe remains invisible to the baby until it enters a world it has never known before.
I don't want anyone to miss out.
Thank you for sharing that, and just so you know, I believe you when you say that you don't want anyone to miss out.
I think you know where I have been, probably more than anyone on SD. You have a ton of patience, and that really means a lot to me, and I am sure to many others.
Thank you for being here and for also being patient. I enjoyed reading your posts and hearing your POV on things.
Now, I am going to shop
and bbiab!
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The Bible does contradict itself on the surface in many different places. From those that I have studied, when you read the full contest of that text the circumstances differ enough that it's not really contradictory. (simple example: "I am hot" "I am cold" one's not a lie, they were both true when they were stated, but the circumstances changed).
As for the bible contradicting itself, it does it a whole different level than "I am hot" and "I am cold". It contradicts on some much bigger issues. I wish I could remember exactly what those were. But, I was in those religion classes almost 10 years ago. It was enough to ruffle the feathers of the professor (who was also a minister or something).