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R U an ultracrepidarian?
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Only read if you are NOT religious and/or do not believe in any 'supreme' being (othe
December 2, 2007 at
08:48 PM
in
Question
personal attacks will not be tolerated and will be mod alerted, if you wish to set someone apart use generalities, such as specific religion not speific person on SD for example
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you dont get the right to feel insulted, u have been warned...
so, peeps, if you dont believe in god, do you feel that ones that do are delusional?
a lot of people will sight karma or other things as 'he got what he had coming' but i argue that it's all a mathematical randomness that on a small scale might seem like karma
perfect example is: when you play poker and u push with the best hand, a LOT of times, you can predict/be so sure that the card will come that will beat you even if the chance of it coming is less than 1:6. when the card comes, some might argue it as karma, but i argue that its all random, just on a small scale randomness doesn't work
discuss....
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you dont get the right to feel insulted, u have been warned...
so, peeps, if you dont believe in god, do you feel that ones that do are delusional?
a lot of people will sight karma or other things as 'he got what he had coming' but i argue that it's all a mathematical randomness that on a small scale might seem like karma
perfect example is: when you play poker and u push with the best hand, a LOT of times, you can predict/be so sure that the card will come that will beat you even if the chance of it coming is less than 1:6. when the card comes, some might argue it as karma, but i argue that its all random, just on a small scale randomness doesn't work
discuss....
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December 6, 2007
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I am still trying to figure out why a primordial soup through evolution gave birth to who we are today is difficult to comprehend. I mean creationists believe poof Adam appeared and then came Eve via one of his ribs. Given everything that we know today that you can scientifically test does this sound even remotely possible? Also given what we know today our little hump happy buddies A&E would have produced many weak generations because through science we have come to learn that incest is bad mmmkay...we need to spread it around a bit mix things up.
Ultimately, God created evil. He may not have done it directly, but the common interpretation is that He created Lucifer, and Lucifer (out of his own free will) decided to rebel against God and became Satan. Then he deceived Adam & Eve and the perfect Garden of Eden became the cold, cruel world.
But like I was saying, God created Lucifer, and God knows ahead of time what choices all are going to make.
So here we have this god that knows one of his angels will rebel and take many others with him, knows that that angel will deceive most of the earth, and ultimately send at least 90% of the world to hell or annihilation, and yet god doesn't do anything because of free will.
And when you look at it that way, in a way it makes Satan more powerful than God - Satan is out deceiving the world and God just shakes His head and says "free will". God could have stopped the evil or not created it in the first place, but instead (according to mainstream beliefs) he did and has done nothing to stop it.
It just doesn't make much sense to me
And I know what you're saying, we would be robots without free will, but why would God create things this way knowing most of creation is going south? Couldn't He have just not created evil at all? Isn't it possible to have free will without evil? Not everything is a black or white choice.
Like I said, it doesn't make much sense
And I know what you're saying, we would be robots without free will, but why would God create things this way knowing most of creation is going south? Couldn't He have just not created evil at all? Isn't it possible to have free will without evil? Not everything is a black or white choice.
As far as the going south part, my feeling is also that when God created Lucifer and instilled in him the knowledge of good and evil, Lucifer was also granted the ability to steal basic ideas and try to create things as well. (Kinda like sharing a laboratory where the beings in it can see what others are working on.) A few pages back I inserted some scripture where Jesus tells the Jewish leaders that they are not his sheep. I'd have to go and scan some pages in the Bible, but at some point, Jesus admonishes some peoples that he knows who their father is (which apparently isn't God) and where the seat of Satan is. In other words, Satan fathered his own clan.
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I think God works similarly. I know I've hit my fence many times, hehe.
I am still trying to figure out why a primordial soup through evolution gave birth to who we are today is difficult to comprehend. I mean creationists believe poof Adam appeared and then came Eve via one of his ribs. Given everything that we know today that you can scientifically test does this sound even remotely possible? Also given what we know today our little hump happy buddies A&E would have produced many weak generations because through science we have come to learn that incest is bad mmmkay...we need to spread it around a bit mix things up.
I do think many religious people are delusional and I think all of them are at least taking truths for granted without demanding substantial proof.
I would not be too surprised if one day we discover that indeed the universe was created with some kind of intelligence behind it... matrix style or something.
But at this point there is simply not enough to prove that and people who believe it already invariably do so based on accepting flawed logic.
As far as Karma goes, I have heard many explanations of how energy's control fate and the universe is tied together etc... and it might all be true... but again, nothing has substantiated it enough for me to go with it.
Back on the first page one of the posters mentioned that in poker you can push all in with the best hand and then call the card that will kill you and get it right a surprising amount of the time...
This is the kind of argument that many people use to support some kind of supreme energy or being (I realize he was not making the argument, but it is the flawed argument that often crops up) but if you look at it closely, you will realize that it doesn't actually happen that way, you just don't remember it all the times it doesn't actually happen more than the stats say it should... you just perceive it that way because no one bothers to remember the times things go like they should, they just remember the times they don't. In this analogy, video tape a table of people playing poker for 10 hours. Then ask them how it went, invariably they will all remember the bad beats and crazy suckouts... watch the video and you will see hundreds of absolutely normal hands that no one remembers. It's no wonder everyone thinks it happens more often than it should when all you remember is the crazy hands... any crazy hands remembered vs no normal hands remembered will always seem like things defied the odds.
The light is not always red when you are in a hurry, you just are busy thinking of other things (like why else you are late or what excuse you will use) to remember that the light was green.
Things are always in the last place you look, not because some divine power is messing with you, but because you stop looking when you find something, so everything is ALWAYS in the last place you look by default.
To that extent, I do think some religious people are delusional... they draw parallels and see causality where there is none... what's scary is when they take offense at having their views questioned.
My view on it is, if what you believe is true, really is true, it can stand up to any line of questioning... so you should never become scared or defensive if you believe the truth... you can't be proven wrong.
A very important quote from I don't remember where is:
Any technology, significantly advanced, is indistinguishable from magic.
I would argue you can replace "magic" with "religion" in there. I just don't understand how people can look back in time, see the fallacies of religion (what people believed must be God/miracle because they couldn't explain it at the time) and go forth making the same mistakes about things we simply can't explain yet.
Every religion has always thought that THEY are the first ones ever to get it right and the fact everyone else screwed up before say anything about the likelihood that they too will someday be debunked.
To that extent, I do think some religious people are delusional... they draw parallels and see causality where there is none... what's scary is when they take offense at having their views questioned.
So we cloned but didn't clone because g_d would have had to alter the chromosome that makes me a man and yourself a woman and therefore by definition would not be cloning.
Cloning by definition means genetically identical...in this case Eve would have to have a X-chromosome in place of the Y-chromosome Adam gave her and therefore not genetically identical.
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